Best options to raise pH

anit77

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#41
I think and air exchanger will help immensely based on the change I see in pH when airing out my fishroom. The jump in pH is dramatic.
I think having an air exchanger is not only good for people with aquarium but for everyone. It's a shame I've only seen them in higher end houses.
With some common sense, running your topoff through a kalk reactor isn't as risky as some people have been leading you to believe. Additionally, the Apex will notify you if things are going sideways. Your programming needs to provide some safety controls and some administration limits. If you are interested, I can post some suggested programming and tips.
I think running kalk through an ATO can work for some people, if, like you say, it's planned out right. I've seen many members run good for a while, then, for what ever reason, their ATO dumps more than intended. DanH on here is a prime example.
When I tried it a couple years ago with a reactor it eventually blew kalk powder into the DT. My system can go through 2-4 gallons a day. I run a Tunze ATO. The only thing I don't like about it is every time the power cycles on it there a 40 second water dump. I guess they do that to be sure the lines are primed but I hate that there's no option to stop that behavior. Two other things I don't like about running kalk through an ATO for larger systems is the variances in Alk that happen due to the rates of evaporation. The other is if you mix it directly into your topoff water without a reactor you're putting the ATO pump at risk of failure, unless you're gravity feeding. Then the solenoid can corrode.
MY preferred way would be to use a reactor and dose with a dosing pump pushing into the reactor. Granted the type of tank someone is running plays a big part too. A LPS/Softy heavy tank with little to no SPS won't need to worry about Alk stability as much. Someone running an SPS or mixed reef that it heavier SPS would want more control of the Alk.
IMHO, do not chase numbers. If your tank is doing well with 7.8pH (as an example), than there is no reason to chase 8.3. Sometimes you might end up cause more harm than good. Good luck!
I agree, you shouldn't chase numbers and tinker daily trying to hit a sweet spot. You'll always be chasing and seldom be where you want it. That lack of stability will cause problems. At the same time I don't see anything wrong with having an end goal and putting a plan in place to get there. Before I was running a calcium reactor and was dosing 2-part it was real easy combined with a co2 scrubber to keep the pH above 8.1. My system is currently running a much lower pH than I'd like at 7.9-8.05, I'm not sweating though, stability is key. I have a plan to get it back up, I just haven't had time to implement it yet.
Also, some people may just want a nice tank to look at and aren't after faster growth. For them if the pH stays above 7.8 and the system is stable all is good.
 

anit77

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#42
I attached the graph from my Apex below to show what dosing Sodium Hydroxide does for pH. I had to make an Alk adjustment and dosed the nights of 3/5 and 3/6 between 9pm & 7am. You can see it raised the floor and when photosynthesis started in the photo period it continued to rise. This is also with a co2 scrubber and if you notice this morning it's back down to 7.9.
In my view any attempt to raise pH should be trying methods to keep it higher at night. This is when in most homes there are the most people in the house and nothing to naturally counteract the elevated co2.

Screenshot_20190308-115019_Apex Fusion.jpg
 

FutureInterest

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#43
Thanks to this thread... I've gone ahead and ordered a CO2 scrubber. My ph is always a lil low... so hopefully this and the kalk stirrer on a doser that I already have will help bump up the ph a bit. :)

For media I got the color changing one from BRS. Once I have an idea of usage rates I'll switch out to bulk soda lime. Or perhaps just mix the two together...
 

hzheng33

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#44
Thanks to this thread... I've gone ahead and ordered a CO2 scrubber. My ph is always a lil low... so hopefully this and the kalk stirrer on a doser that I already have will help bump up the ph a bit. :)

For media I got the color changing one from BRS. Once I have an idea of usage rates I'll switch out to bulk soda lime. Or perhaps just mix the two together...
Let us know how it fast you go thru them Jin. I heard that you go thru them pretty fast and can get expensive.
 

FutureInterest

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#45
Aye will do. My understanding is that you need to keep the media damp to make it last longer which is why BRS recommends adding water to the scrubber. I may end up recirculating it with skimmer gas exhaust to keep it damp and to decrease the media usage as well.
 

anit77

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#46
Let us know how it fast you go thru them Jin. I heard that you go thru them pretty fast and can get expensive.
Aye will do. My understanding is that you need to keep the media damp to make it last longer which is why BRS recommends adding water to the scrubber. I may end up recirculating it with skimmer gas exhaust to keep it damp and to decrease the media usage as well.
Yes, adding water to the bottom of the housing helps. But the best way to run it and extend the life of the media is setting up a closed loop of the air from the skimmate locker, scrubber & the airline of the skimmer. This keeps the air real humid and you're only scrubbing co2 from the tank water. I get about two to three weeks out of the media this way. Smaller systems will get a lot more life.
I bought a 5 gallon jug of media last summer and have only used about a gallon, maybe less. The jug cost me $100 delivered.

I started a thread on R2R about this last July.
https://www.reef2reef.com/threads/question-for-those-that-have-a-basement-system-co2.414772/
The 2nd page is where the info about the scrubber starts.. look for the posts from Want2BS8ed about running the scrubber in a loop.
Jin has seen my setup and you will tomorrow Hui ;)
 
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anit77

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#48
Your using 2part now no need to start kalk. Actually yours isn't bad to begin with. I'd switch from soda ash to sodium hydroxide and dose it at night and see what that does. If it balances out a little higher without adding more equipment & cost... call it a day.
 

schwaggs

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#50
My Apex Kalk top-off system:

1) I use an aqualifter pump that has a slow feed rate - almost a drip.
2) I limit the amount of water that can be fed into the tank each day. I DO NOT have it connected to an endless water supply. I have my RODI fill a 50 gallon holding tank and have the pickup for the aqua-lifter positioned so a maximum of 5 gallons can be fed into the tank over a 2 day period.
3) I have the aqualifter programmed to run at most 1.5 minutes out of every 10.
4) If the level of the sump is full, the aqualifter will not run at all.
5) If the pH is above 8.3, the aqualifter will not run at all.
6) If the lights are on, the aqualifter will not run at all.
7) I have the kalk reactor mix for 5 minutes every hour.
8) I don't dose for 10 minutes after the kalk was mixed to allow the kalk to settle (avoids dosing slurry).

Kalk Mixing outlet - kalk mixing pump
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
OSC 000:00/005:00/55:00 Then ON

Kalk Ready (virtual outlet)
Fallback OFF
Set ON
If Output Kalk_Mixing = ON Then OFF
Defer 010:00 Then ON

Topoff outlet - Aqualifter pump
Fallback OFF
Set OFF
OSC 000:00/001:30/008:30 Then ON
If Output Main_Halide1 = ON Then OFF
If Output Main_Halide2 = ON Then OFF
If Output Main_Halide3 = ON Then OFF
If Output Sump_Fill = OFF Then OFF
If FeedC 000 Then ON
If Output Sump2Full = ON Then OFF
If Output Kalk_Ready = OFF Then OFF
If pH > 8.30 Then OFF
If Output Water_Change = ON Then OFF
Defer 000:05 Then OFF
 

liverock27

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#52
I ordered a custom baffle kit to allow me to divid my sump’s protein compartment in half and use one side for a refugium. I also ordered a light so helpfully I will have everything in about a week in half to get my refugium up and running.
My plan is to let it run for a few weeks and see where my pH is. After that I will decide if I want to set up my CO2 Scrubber.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

anit77

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#54
I'm just about done with the kalk stirrer I'm modifying. Should have it on line tomorrow night, then I'll do a write up on it. Would have had it finished today but was too lazy the first half of the day then had to wire up the dimming for my ATS lights. They're too powerful for starting out! With the stirrer and ATS running right the pH should be back up in a few weeks.
 

lshin037

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#55
My PH was around 8.07-8.16. Thought I'd give this CO2 scrubber a try. My PH was 8.3 throughout last night and its up at 8.37 right now. I've been trying to dial in my alk. Thought I had it down but it went from 8.7 to 8.15 overnight. I saw a BRS video about CO2 scrubbers and they mentioned that they're demand increased so much that they had to double the dosage. Are you all (with scrubbers) seeing this dramatic demand as well?
 
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