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Oh I’m 100% here and as involved in this hobby as I am because of Jin. I wasn’t kidding when I said I counted him as a friend and mentor in reefing.
Website Shutdown and Restoration Saturday, January 16th at 9am.
- Thread starter Shawn
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Don’t worry about him Shawn. You do what you gotta do to get control of the website. I’m honestly not surprised this is happening. I’ll send you a pm on fb.
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Forgetting the politics of the situation, is ARC a registered legal entity? I see from the whois that the owner of the domain name at least is ARC: https://who.is/whois/atlantareefclub.org
Based on what you said though, the hosting is in Jin's name?
If the hosting is in his name, you may be out of luck, but given that you have records of reimbursing him for it, there's probably legal standing to claim ownership.
Thoughts on talking to a lawyer and threatening legal action? Often times, a certified letter from a lawyer is enough to resolve an issue like this...
Based on what you said though, the hosting is in Jin's name?
If the hosting is in his name, you may be out of luck, but given that you have records of reimbursing him for it, there's probably legal standing to claim ownership.
Thoughts on talking to a lawyer and threatening legal action? Often times, a certified letter from a lawyer is enough to resolve an issue like this...
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yes, hosting is in his name.
A letter is not enough to regain control from the hosting company. They want a court order. We’ve discussed this with them. That’ll take months and cost at least $5,000.
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Also yes, we’re a state recognized legal entity.
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this isn't where I parked my car...
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We’re going to get away from it man. I promise you that.
"why is old president dram everywhere. Seems like we can’t get away from it anywhere lol"
Tell it brother. I'm 42 years old and I didn't sign up for this.
What I can tell you is that I was an active part of this decision and it wasn't taken lightly. We absolutely 100% don't want to revert back to a previous version of the website. What we really want is two simple things. First, we want to put everything in ARC's corporate name paid for by the ARC accounts. The end goal of this step is to put everything in a legal trust so something like this never happens ever again. It's not even a personal thing, what if I had the password to the website and got smooshed by a car? I'm trustworthy but I-285 can get a little crazy. Second, we want a few folks to have access to the website's back end to do things like update the software, install security patches and create backups. Another result of this step would be having more than one skilled person that can help troubleshoot when something goes wrong with the site. All we need in order to do any of this is a single password. We had it and it got changed back in October. Ever since then we've been trying to get it. A single password, that's it.
Tell it brother. I'm 42 years old and I didn't sign up for this.
What I can tell you is that I was an active part of this decision and it wasn't taken lightly. We absolutely 100% don't want to revert back to a previous version of the website. What we really want is two simple things. First, we want to put everything in ARC's corporate name paid for by the ARC accounts. The end goal of this step is to put everything in a legal trust so something like this never happens ever again. It's not even a personal thing, what if I had the password to the website and got smooshed by a car? I'm trustworthy but I-285 can get a little crazy. Second, we want a few folks to have access to the website's back end to do things like update the software, install security patches and create backups. Another result of this step would be having more than one skilled person that can help troubleshoot when something goes wrong with the site. All we need in order to do any of this is a single password. We had it and it got changed back in October. Ever since then we've been trying to get it. A single password, that's it.
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Well, login name and password - let's be clear. LOL
So without the password you cannot download the files? Trying to understand. Are you switching platforms and moving the database to a new server provider and without the password you are stuck with October 2020 backups? Can you not show the current service provider that the domain and the bills have been paid for by the ARC?
What it sounds like to me is Jin @FutureInterest changed the password in October (when 2021 officer nominations were being made) and won't give it to anyone else, correct? Perhaps if everyone appealed to his better instincts he would furnish the new password, I wouldn't think he'd want the whole club to suffer.
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I was actually more thinking have an attorney write a letter to Jin informing that he doesn't have the legal right to withhold access and that you'll pursue legal action which he would be required to then spend time/money to defend against...
It's a similar situation if you hired a web developer to build you a site, which they hosted on their platform. If you paid this developer to build it, you own the rights to the site, and they would be compelled to give you access to it.
Honestly, most of the board still consider Jin our friend (regardless of if he considers us his friend). We love Jin, are thankful for him, express it to him regularly, and have been trying to connect with him for months. Even if he doesn’t answer phone calls or return texts. But it seems clearly that he has been intentionally avoiding us (surely for a reason, whether or not we know the reason).
It’s only after several consistent months that we recognized our obligation to the club has now outweighed our ability to simply continue positive communication with him and wait on him to come around. We need to be prepared, have access to the website, and do what’s best for the community in order to both protect it from future outages and to allow it to grow in a protected environment.
This decision was not light hearted. And we sincerely love Jin and want the best for both him and the community.
It’s only after several consistent months that we recognized our obligation to the club has now outweighed our ability to simply continue positive communication with him and wait on him to come around. We need to be prepared, have access to the website, and do what’s best for the community in order to both protect it from future outages and to allow it to grow in a protected environment.
This decision was not light hearted. And we sincerely love Jin and want the best for both him and the community.
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This is exactly how I feel. Perfectly said Andrew. Thank you.
This sounds exactly the same as a situation where a web developer won’t allow access to website. Usually, a lawyer can go to smallclaims court and push action through and regain control from web hosting site. Typical cost is $5000 to do this but often you can recover these fees from developer in court. With the pandemic though I do not know which county courts would be the correct one for ARC and the court system caseload delay and the state of urgency in current web platform for ARC etc.
I am sure the officers and BOD have thought all these things through and weighed which options were the best for the club. That is why they are in their positions and I have to trust that they will do what is best for the club.
Sorry to lose data, but would rather not lose touch with the ARC and have a working platform.
Sorry everyone is going through this
and wish there was an easier amicable way to resolve this
I am sure the officers and BOD have thought all these things through and weighed which options were the best for the club. That is why they are in their positions and I have to trust that they will do what is best for the club.
Sorry to lose data, but would rather not lose touch with the ARC and have a working platform.
Sorry everyone is going through this
and wish there was an easier amicable way to resolve this Still seems more appropriate to take progressive legal steps to keep the site intact and get access transferred.
Worst case the site gets nuked out of spite and we roll back to the October backup. If it's hacked before it can be transferred and patched, again, there's the fallback to October. There may even be lawyers in the club that would do the letter writing and filings cheap/free.
Friendships are understandable, but one side in this friendship is clearly not holding up that end of the bargain.
Best case the threat of legal defense fees makes things move, let alone starting up a new business in the reef community burning bridges with a big group of potential customers.
From the HOA angle beings it was mentioned as another thankless board job, I presided over one that had to sue to get common areas deeded over to us from a defunct developer that wouldn't do it out of spite. Thankfully we won by default when they never responded to the suit and the court awarded the property to us free and clear. The same process could play out here and you'd have the papers to show the hosting companies to get everything transferred..
Worst case the site gets nuked out of spite and we roll back to the October backup. If it's hacked before it can be transferred and patched, again, there's the fallback to October. There may even be lawyers in the club that would do the letter writing and filings cheap/free.
Friendships are understandable, but one side in this friendship is clearly not holding up that end of the bargain.
Best case the threat of legal defense fees makes things move, let alone starting up a new business in the reef community burning bridges with a big group of potential customers.
From the HOA angle beings it was mentioned as another thankless board job, I presided over one that had to sue to get common areas deeded over to us from a defunct developer that wouldn't do it out of spite. Thankfully we won by default when they never responded to the suit and the court awarded the property to us free and clear. The same process could play out here and you'd have the papers to show the hosting companies to get everything transferred..
You don’t know Jin