An oldie but a newbie!

[tmlrfrancis]

The hubby and I are starting a new set up after a 10 year absence from saltwater fishkeeping - so many new and improved techniques, equipment, etc - (fire destroyed first tank 10 years ago...). Setting up a 94 gal cube in the bedroom... Will be coral/fish combo this time; 1st tank was a 65 gal FOWLR.
We've purchased our tank/stand, sump & return pump, Reef Octopus Bio-churn and protein skimmer, Radion XR30W Pro lights, MP40... About ready to put in substrate, water, and live rock. Any suggestions or opinions on better method of aquascaping (live rock added before of after substrate for better stability)? We're planning to use ~ 100# of LR.

Thanks! We're looking forward to 'meeting' everyone! :fish:

 

[tmlrfrancis]

Awesome! I'll check it out!

 

[ringo®]

Welcome aboard! I would go rock first, then sand.

 

[joseayes]

First thing come to my mind when I read "fire destroyed a tank" was thinking about reefstylo from New York or New Jersey, and he had a short circuit or some sort that destroyed his whole apartment. Great guy with lots of info on reef keeping.
Welcome again!

 

[raz0945]

Welcome to the ARC!

 

[tmlrfrancis]

Our fire was due to a lightning strike... (middle of a clear day, everyone at work, go figure!) We were devastated with the loss - but still, much more to be thankful for!
We're excited to be getting back in, going bigger, and starting corals. We just want to make sure we start out right to avoid unnecessary losses/mistakes!
Main reason we're checking to see how folks feel about setting up (rocks first or substrate first) is because we'd like a pair of watchman gobies and their pistol shrimp. We know they tunnel, and don't want a rock-slide catastrophe as a result!

 

[raz0945]

When I start my tanks I put about 1/2" of sand down then put the rock i have chosen for my base down(some rocks that will have caves or hollows in them), I twist the rocks to make sure they are down good then pour the rest of the sand over the rocks. It makes the rocks stabilize and helps prevent rockslides. This has helped with a diamond goby and a very large pink spotted shrimp goby & tiger pistol shrimp(the tiger has dug a tunnel from one end to the other). Hope this is helpful! Holley

 

[tmlrfrancis]

Raz0945;908821 wrote: When I start my tanks I put about 1/2" of sand down then put the rock i have chosen for my base down(some rocks that will have caves or hollows in them), I twist the rocks to make sure they are down good then pour the rest of the sand over the rocks.

Sounds reasonable! Any suggestions for which expoy to use to join the rocks together when placing them? :thumbs:

 

[raz0945]

I didn't use any, the only epoxy I have used has been the stick kind that comes in gray and pink, to build up between two rocks to attach a large coral. It worked great, a couple of years later when I moved it, I used a chisel. Holley

 

[ringo®]

Some people like to drill the rock and attach them with acrylic rods. Keeps it sturdy but still removable if the need arises.

 

[tmlrfrancis]

Ringo®;908827 wrote: Some people like to drill the rock and attach them with acrylic rods. Keeps it sturdy but still removable if the need arises.

That actually sounds like the better option... no worries if something has to be moved!
Thanks!

 

[redstang]

With a burrowing fish I'd definitely put rocks down first. Some people will put egg crate down, then rock, then sand. The egg crate will help keep pressure points off the glass. Think this is what I'll do on my upgrade.

I have a yellow watchman goby and she and her pistol shrimp have tunnels everywhere. I never know what burrow they'll come out of at feeding time. Pretty cool but I'm glad that there is little to no chance that the rocks could cave in on them.

And welcome!

 

[ringo®]

RedStang;908835 wrote: With a burrowing fish I'd definitely put rocks down first. Some people will put egg crate down, then rock, then sand. The egg crate will help keep pressure points off the glass.

I used a sheet of acrylic. Eggcrate always seems to get uncovered by something unless you're using a bunch of sand to cover it.

 

[tmlrfrancis]

Thanks y'all... some very interesting ideas and suggestions!
Ringo, Do you use acrylic from the big box stores?

RedStang, Are there no problems with egg crates harboring dead spots or other potentially hazardous situations?

 

[redstang]

tmlrfrancis;908848 wrote: Thanks y'all... some very interesting ideas and suggestions!
Ringo, Do you use acrylic from the big box stores?

RedStang, Are there no problems with egg crates harboring dead spots or other potentially hazardous situations?

As far as I know, no. But Ringo's suggestion accomplishes the same thing and I like it better :yes:.

 

[ringo®]

tmlrfrancis;908848 wrote: Ringo, Do you use acrylic from the big box stores?

Yep......no need to get fancy on something I shouldn't ever see.

 

[tmlrfrancis]

Okay... so I'm a little intimidated (envious) as I've looked around at some of the set-ups and read about the extensive plumbing! Is all of that necessary for corals?!
FOWLR was fairly simple, and we've got everything purchased thus far plumbed under the tank. The sump is large enough for the skimmer and bio-churn/reactor. We don't have any monitoring equip. yet..., and we're hoping to avoid a chiller.
We don't have the ability to go into another room or under the floor with expansions to the system. We're hoping to keep our 'extra' water in the basement for top-offs and water changes, but we're planning to buy our RO/DI water rather than generating it ourselves. (We did that with the first tank, and there was WAY too much waste water! Can you say massive water bill?!)
Anyway, we'd love to have corals, but I don't want to introduce anything that doesn't have a chance because our set-up is insufficient to meet its needs (can't stand wasteful death).
IS it possible to successfully maintain the water quality and such without such large back-up systems, etc.?

 

[ringo®]

Yes. Lot's of the stuff you already have isn't a requirement of reef tanks, they just make life easier.

I would give the RO/DI serious consideration though. The uptick in the water bill is minimal and if the waste water bothers you, collect it in a bucket and use it to water the yard. Driving back and forth to the LFS for water is a huge pain to me. Depending on the location of your local store and the frequency of trips , gas consumption may be more than the increase in the water bill.

 

[y-not]

My only suggestion comes from the experience I had with my first tank.

If at all possible, mount the LR on legs.
I used a combo of 3/4 inch, 1 inch and 2 inch PVC pipe. All were cut to about 2 inches because we wanted a deep sand bed and we wanted sand burrowing creatures.

So...my wife and I spent hours upon hours in the garage, setting up the rock just how we wanted it.

We drilled the rock and pegged most all of it together. Zip tied parts that could not be seen. Epoxied some other parts together. And epoxied legs to all of the contact points so that there would be an even displacement of rock weight on the glass.

Once it was all together, it was really easy to just pick it up, set it in the tank. Pour the sub-strait around the legs/base of the rock.

And...if ever we need to relocate the tank, it's just a matter of lifting the rock out as once piece, capture the livestock, drain the tank and move it.

Plus...in my first tank, I had a power head relocate it's self. It blew out the sand under the rock, the rock fell and we were lucky that it did not break the glass.

With the rock pegged, zip tied, epoxied and mounted on legs, it'll stand on it's own regardless of what happens to the sub-strait. All of the sand burrowing creatures can burrow to their hearts content. They can go under the rock all they want and not cause a problem.

Edit:

tmlrfrancis;908848 wrote: Thanks y'all... some very interesting ideas and suggestions!
Ringo, Do you use acrylic from the big box stores?

RedStang, Are there no problems with egg crates harboring dead spots or other potentially hazardous situations?

I found Carbon Fiber rods at a hobby shop. They were about $6 for a 3 foot section. Easy to cut. And required a smaller drill bit for the rocks than the acrylic rods I found.

We did use some egg crate under a couple of the PVC peg legs just to help level things out a bit where needed. No dead spots.

This was the tank shortly after adding sub-strait.
http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/photoplog/images/7119/medium/1_DSCN8443.JPG" alt="" />

And how it looks today:
[IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/photoplog/images/7119/medium/1_Full_Tank_Shot.jpg alt="" />

 

[y-not]

Ringo®;908853 wrote: Yes. Lot's of the stuff you already have isn't a requirement of reef tanks, they just make life easier.

I would give the RO/DI serious consideration though. The uptick in the water bill is minimal and if the waste water bothers you, collect it in a bucket and use it to water the yard. Driving back and forth to the LFS for water is a huge pain to me. Depending on the location of your local store and the frequency of trips , gas consumption may be more than the increase in the water bill.

Yeah, what Ringo said.
Plus it's nice to have RO/DI on hand to rinse off the tank things.
I always felt that I HAD TO treat the RO/DI from the LFS like gold.

Now I rinse everything tank related with RO/DI and never give it a second thought.

The other uptick is that if you stay out of the LFS, you are less likely to come home with something other than water. :roll:

Edit:

tmlrfrancis;908852 wrote: We did that with the first tank, and there was WAY too much waste water! Can you say massive water bill?!

Look into BRS's water saver addition to the RO/DI systems.
It requires a 75 GPD system and 60 PSI at the source.
It'll almost double the RO/DI output and cut the waste water by half or more. Or so they claim. :unsure:

It's worth looking into anyway.