cyano and hair algae eaters and a lighting question

oil_fan · Jul 29, 2009

I've been dealing with both cyano and hair algae for a bit now. Cyano off and on for close to a year and hair algae after I made the mistake of trying Red Sea salt.

I did some research tonight and found some natural predators of both and just wondering if anyone has any experience with these hermit crabs and snails?

Mexican Dwarf Hermit Crabs aka Clibanarius digueti

Suppose to love cyano and hair algae and will attack it in groups.

Dwarf Blue Leg Hermit Crab aka Clibanarius tricolor

According to LiveAquaria.com:

As a voracious scavenger, this omnivore can get into the smallest crevices and openings within live rock to consume nuisance algae including hair algae and cyanobacteria

Cerith Snails and Nerite Snails

Also reported to like eating the stuff off the side of aquariums including cyano.

Now for my lighting question for those who know a lot more about lights than I do. From what I found, cyano loves light in the 525 nm range. Now last year after an outbreak of this stuff, I replaced my bulbs only to have another outbreak a month or 2 later. I have this set of lights:

http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+3733+12109&pcatid=12109">http://www.drsfostersmith.com/product/prod_display.cfm?c=3578+3733+12109&pcatid=12109</a>

It's the Coralife Aqualights Compact Fluorescent which is 2 x 10k bulb and 2 x Actinic running at 96 watts each. For those experts, would the combination of these lights be in the right light spectrum that cyano needs to flourish?

oil_fan · Jul 29, 2009

65 gallon tank plus sump setup for a bit over a year and half now.

0 Ammonia
0 Nitrites
0 Nitrates (before everything went haywire was a bit over 5 ppm)
Phosphates also read 0 but likely due to being eaten from algae and cyano.

pH is 8.1 and rarely changes.

SG is 1.026

Temp hovers around 80F.

Fish are healthy. Don't ask about corals. Most were killed by the algae which I'm slowly getting a handle on. Only my mushrooms, green frogspawn and purple brush gorgonian are ok.

oil_fan · Jul 29, 2009

blu_devl_06;374873 wrote: how much flow do you have?

I have some monster zebra stripe turbo snails that eat lots of cyano and hair algae, really fast, but they are huge, and the best way to deal with this is to find out what caused it, and treat it accordingly. You have since switched salts back to seachem reef I hope?

Right now I'm back to Oceanic. I had tried Red Sea to see if it would help. And that's when it occurred to me that Dr's Foster and Smith don't post negative reviews. :boo:

oil_fan · Jul 29, 2009

So Seachem Reef is good, I take? If so, I'll get a bucket of the stuff in the next couple of days.

ralph atl · Jul 29, 2009

I doubt it's your salt, but having a good salt will benefit ya anyway. Seachem Reef is great!

You must export the same or more nutrients than you put in. Overfeeding, tap water, high phosphate foods, etc. 
 
 
Phosphate reduction/ removal and high trates could be the answer. Wet skimming with a skimmer that is rated at least double your water volume. If you cannot get a fuge or sump (you can maybe make a "Rubbermaid sump with cheato in it for a few bucks) you can get a $35.00 hang on phosphate reactor for your tank and put some GFO in there. In the future, you'll most likely need a refugium with Macro algae. If you choose GFO, you’ll need to start VERY SLOWLY! Use 25% of the recommended media, slowly increasing every 2-4 weeks. You need to acclimate your tank inhabitants over at least a 2 month period especially is you have any stony corals. Once acclimated you’ll need to change your Iron based media in the phosphate reactor more often. Your media will get saturated in 2 weeks or so depending upon how much is bound up in your rocks, tank, algae, etc. Use less media, change every 2 weeks. Use a great test kit like DD Merck, Hack, or colormeter or send to AWT. If you already have a fuge & reactor, be aggressive & change the media every 2 weeks.
 
When you do your water change, take the end of the hose and suck all the algae down like a vacuum. It'll take a few water changes, but it works (especially after the phosphate remover kicks in)
 
Use a phosphate reactor with some phosar or ROWA or whatever, and something to lower nitrates like a fuge, AZNO3, Vodka, VSV or other carbon source. 
 
 
check out:
 
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-11/rhf/index.php">http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-11/rhf/index.php</a>
 
[IMG]http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-09/rhf/index.php">http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2006-09/rhf/index.php</a>
 
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/july2003/chem.htm
 
[IMG]http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-05/rhf/index.php">http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-05/rhf/index.php</a>
 
[IMG]http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-05/eb/index.php">http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2005-05/eb/index.php</a>
 
[IMG]http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/august2003/chem.htm">http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/august2003/chem.htm</a>
 
http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1349443
 
[IMG]http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/sept2002/chem.htm">http://www.advancedaquarist.com/issues/sept2002/chem.htm</a>
 
 
 
VSV:
[IMG]http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2008-08/nftt/index.php">http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/20...nftt/index.php</a>

[IMG]http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1225324">http://reefcentral.com/forums/showth...readid=1225324</a>
 
 
[IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=22849&highlight=vodka">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forum...ighlight=vodka</a>

flipturn88 · Jul 29, 2009

As Blu Devl mentioned, flow is something important to consider. Also, are you running a skimmer, and if so, which one?

FWIW, mexican turbo snails are awesome grazers of algae-laden rocks that have been "mowed" back. They are big and love to knock over frags, but they do their job quite well.

Hope this helps!

oil_fan · Jul 29, 2009

Yes I have a sump and protein skimmer. It's a Marineland Marine Pro 100.

As for flow, I have the return pump (not sure what that's rated at offhand and I'm at work right now) and then there's around about 1450 gph between 2 powerheads and my UV lamp.

And I have an RO/DI unit and I regularly check the TDS on it.

I did have some turbo snails but they would just leave the stuff alone. Only one ever touched the stuff but he died a couple of weeks ago and I haven't had a chance to replace them.

jennm · Jul 29, 2009

IME, claims that certain creatures "eat" cyanobacter are a myth. Hair algae *maybe* - I have an old, scarred purple tang that eats everything that grows green, from hair algae to bryopis... but he's rather an exception.

Most creatures that "eat" cyano, actually just disturb it and turn it over, giving the illusion that they eat it - but it's still there.

If you have hair algae and cyano, you do have nitrate and phosphate, it's just not in the water column where you can test it.

How many fish? What do you feed, and how often, and how much? What, if anything, are you dosing, and how much?

Tank size too please - I don't see it in the thread here (or I missed it).

Jenn

oil_fan · Jul 29, 2009

Hey Jenn,
My tank is 65 gallons. 6 fish total: 2 clowns, yellow tang, royal granma, green chromis and a flame angel. I feed 5 times a week. For about a month I was feeding every second day but it didn’t have an impact and I just went back up to 5 days a week plus nori twice a week for the tang and flame angel.
As for what I feed: flake maybe once a week. Mysis 2 or 3 thimes a week (sometimes with garlic) and once or twice brine shrimp. As to how much, usually it’s all gone in 3 or 4 minutes. Occasionally there might be a bit left over.

kevheng · Jul 29, 2009

what about lawnmower blenny? don't they eat algae? if so i have one for sale for 10$ obo.

jennm · Jul 29, 2009

I would cut back the feeding a bit - at least until the problem subsides. Even if you want to keep feeding daily, cut the portions a bit - and perhaps omit the flake. Some brands contain phosphate (probably all brands do - some more than others).

Jenn

oil_fan · Jul 29, 2009

I really don't feed flake that often. Usually just if I'm in a hurry to get out of the house. I'll probably cut down on the portions for a while, look into new salt (mine will run out in a month or 2 anyways) and pickup some more snails.

tgray3 · Jul 29, 2009

As far as cyano goes, i used a bacterial booster and my cyano was gone almost over night.......another member had the same experience as i did with it.......As for the hair algae, like Cliff and others mentioned above, when you think you have enough snails add some more. I also got a couple of lettuce nudis to take care of a little bryopsis. I had read that they won't touch H.A. but the pair i have ate anything that was green. I don't think thats the norm though.

weaglereefer · Jul 29, 2009

Ditch the flakes for sinking pellets. Now that I have my DJ switches, I can turn off my Koralia powerheads (could turn off the return too if I felt the need). I drop 3-4 pellets in at a time. If there is a bubble on the pellet, the fish will suck it in, spit it out, and eat it again. After 6-7 pellets each, the chromis are full and I drop pellets to the firefish and yellow watchman at the bottom. They will get the pellets as they fall. As soon as I see one hit the substrate, I know they're done, and that pellet is usually swarmed by hermits in 5-6min.

I have noticed a reduction in skimmate since I've started feeding with pellets. I still give frozen mysis once a week or so, but no more flakes for me.

oil_fan · Jul 29, 2009

I just bought another 9 snails. We'll see how that goes.

I'll buy some Seachem Reef salt next week.

kevheng · Jul 29, 2009

Oil_Fan;374878 wrote: So Seachem Reef is good, I take? If so, I'll get a bucket of the stuff in the next couple of days.

i use Seachem Reef in my tank and it is great:thumbs:. no problems. and like everyone has said snails are great and crabs will take out the snails.

cyano and hair algae eaters and a lighting question

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