Electronic MH ballest

[jwils27]

as of now i have magnetic balllest on my 250w MH. these things are E hogs. i want to find somthing alittle more economical monthly. either icecap ballest or T5s 8 54 w. the tank is a 135 and is 24 inches deep. the lights would be stagared if they are the T5's. so if you are confused on my question it is will electronic ballest cut back on my E bill that much to justify the 200+ dollar purchase? or should i go with T5's and get rid of my MH all together?

 

[james s_]

Electronic ballast will not help your power bill really,you are still firing a 250W bulb no matter which ballast you are using.They say you get 15-20% more efficiency out of them,they run cooler,and provide a more consistent lamp color. But I doubt it would make that big of a difference in your power bill. T5's would be the way to go,if you want to save power.Use Advanced Elec. ballast and run them normally without using Icecap's and overdriving them.About as efficient of any of the options out there right now,except LED's.

 

[skriz]

Using an electronic should make a difference in your elec bill because it will reduce power consumption. You also have to take into consideration the heat the magnetics will put off. You will have to cool that excess heat, which inderectly effects the e-bill. I don't know how much it will actually relate to though.

like 46bfinga said, T5 will offer you the best power economy. LED is too expensive to be worth while.

 

[james s_]

Yes it will make a difference in your bill but I would bet that it would be very minimal.Then you have to take into consideration is it the the lights that made a difference or did the AC just run less,or did I wash clothes less,etc. Unless your running 10 400 Watt lights 12 hours a day then switching to Electronic at the cost of replacing ballast and going thru the trouble would not seem beneficial to me.Of course this opinion is solely mine and its your tank and your money so take it for what its worth.If it was me, I would spend more time watching and enjoying your tank then worrying about saving a couple dollars a month.

 

[roland jacques]

46bfinga;67191 wrote: Yes it will make a difference in your bill but I would bet that it would be very minimal.Then you have to take into consideration is it the the lights that made a difference or did the AC just run less,or did I wash clothes less,etc. Unless your running 10 400 Watt lights 12 hours a day then switching to Electronic at the cost of replacing ballast and going thru the trouble would not seem beneficial to me.Of course this opinion is solely mine and its your tank and your money so take it for what its worth.If it was me, I would spend more time watching and enjoying your tank then worrying about saving a couple dollars a month.

I totaly agree (floresent ballast is another story)

I'd add one more thing as far as Par to watts for power ratio. T-5 normal output lamp is the best par to watts (LED aside(down side you need more lamps...) t-5 High output second.

Good "clean" Parabolic reflectors will maximize that ratio for any kind of light.

If you a DIYer I have some extra t-5 HO 54watts Quiktronic ballast cheep.

 

[ouling]

Most electronic ballast, at least the PFO standard or especially the PFO HQI will put out much more light than a magnetic ballast. The PFO HQI draws somewhere in the range of 300-350w, because it puts out so much power, you're not going to see any difference on your power bill when compared to a less efficient magnetic ballast. Like BFinger said, it's only a few bucks worth of difference, but you will get alot more light.

 

[roland jacques]

ouling;67196 wrote: Most electronic ballast, at least the PFO standard or especially the PFO HQI will put out much more light than a magnetic ballast. The PFO HQI draws somewhere in the range of 300-350w, because it puts out so much power, you're not going to see any difference on your power bill when compared to a less efficient magnetic ballast. Like BFinger said, it's only a few bucks worth of difference, but you will get alot more light.

Do you have the link to the site that did all the ballast comparisions. i think thier a watts vs Lummens/par that i need some clarifacation on. Im thinking that the Electronic MH ballast used More power to Overdrive those lamps

 

[skriz]

No. The HQI ballast overdrives the bulbs. The E-ballast runs the bulbs as they are "supposed" to be driven.

here you go:

 

[kevinc]

ouling;67196 wrote: Most electronic ballast, at least the PFO standard or especially the PFO HQI will put out much more light than a magnetic ballast.

The PFO HQI ballast (and the PFO standard) is a magnetic ballast. The 250W HQI is an ANSI M80 ballast, and the 250 probe start (standard) is an ANSI M58 ballast.

 

[kevinc]

Skriz;67234 wrote: No. The HQI ballast overdrives the bulbs. The E-ballast runs the bulbs as they are "supposed" to be driven.

Actually the HQI ballast drives HQI bulbs the way they are supposed to be driven. The electronic ballast drives them as if they were normal SE bulbs, at a lower current level, thus putting out less light with less power draw.

 

[skriz]

An HQI ballast will overdrive even the hqi bulbs. An e-ballast will run a 250w bulb at 250w. the hqi will push it harder.

http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/alldataforalamp.php?x1=20&x2=8&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=PFO 250W HQI (M80)&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;">XDE 250W 10000K DE 1</span></a>[IMG]http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/alldataforaballast.php?x1=20&x2=8&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=PFO 250W HQI (M80)&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;">PFO 250W HQI (M80)</span></a> ppfd-109 cct-7026 [B]watts-314[/B] volts-121 amps-2.77
<p style="text-align:center;">[IMG]http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/passed-link-id.php?x1=20&x2=6&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=Icecap 250W Electronic&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;"></span></a>

[IMG]http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/alldataforalamp.php?x1=20&x2=6&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=Icecap 250W Electronic&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;">XDE 250W 10000K DE 1</span></a>[IMG]http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/alldataforaballast.php?x1=20&x2=6&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=Icecap 250W Electronic&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;">Icecap 250W Electronic</span></a> ppfd-95 cct-7097 [B]watts-253[/B] volts-120 amps-2.330

(ref Sanjays Reef Lighting Pages)

 

[roland jacques]

Thanks for the link. there was another one a little easyer to read but this one is awesome

whats the defferance bettween HQI and Electonic when it come to ballast?
With lamps people call DE lamps HQI and SE lamps mogels . im just trying to get on the same page here.


Whats ppfd & cct stand for?

 

[skriz]

HQi is a magnetic ballast that is designed to run hqi bulbs. It has a ballast, capacitor, ignitor. and electronic ballast is an electronic ballast-stays cool.

ppfd, is for a simple definition, par. it's really more, but for easy purposes, par.

cct, is the color temp of the bulb. a 10k bulb is supposed to be a cct of 10,000. as you can see the xm 10k only shows 7k!

 

[roland jacques]

So they list 3 types of ballast
Magnetic = SE moguls,
HQI = DE
Electronic = can be for one or the other.

I Know ppfd relates to PAR. Really would like to more on that one. Anyone else on the ppfd?

anyway it looks
electronic ballast may be 8-10 % more efficient and HQI a little more.
So maybe you save 3-4$ per mo by switching ballast.

You could probably save more looking at your pumps efficiecy ruining 24-7

 

[kevinc]

Skriz;67245 wrote: An HQI ballast will overdrive even the hqi bulbs. An e-ballast will run a 250w bulb at 250w. the hqi will push it harder.

http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/alldataforalamp.php?x1=20&x2=8&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=PFO 250W HQI (M80)&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;">XDE 250W 10000K DE 1</span></a>[IMG]http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/alldataforaballast.php?x1=20&x2=8&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=PFO 250W HQI (M80)&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;">PFO 250W HQI (M80)</span></a> ppfd-109 cct-7026 [B]watts-314[/B] volts-121 amps-2.77


[IMG]http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/alldataforalamp.php?x1=20&x2=6&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=Icecap 250W Electronic&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;">XDE 250W 10000K DE 1</span></a>[IMG]http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/alldataforaballast.php?x1=20&x2=6&x3=XDE 250W 10000K DE 1&x4=Icecap 250W Electronic&x5=Y"><span style="color: #0000ff;">Icecap 250W Electronic</span></a> ppfd-95 cct-7097 [B]watts-253[/B] volts-120 amps-2.330

(ref Sanjays Reef Lighting Pages)[/QUOTE]

That doesn't mean the bulb is being overdriven by the HQI ballast. The ballast is not 100% efficient, if it is using 250 watts that means the bulb is not being driven with 250 watts of power. Again, HQI bulbs are designed to be driven by HQI ballasts. They are not being overdriven by these ballasts; they are being properly driven by these ballasts. Electronic ballasts will drive HQI bulbs - however, they don't drive them as HQI bulbs are designed to be driven, they drive them like they are SE bulbs. The bulbs will fire and will work - you are just not getting all the PAR that the bulbs are designed to put out.

Similarly, Icecap ballasts like the 660 will drive T5 bulbs. However, they are not designed to drive T5 bulbs - they are designed to drive standard VHO bulbs. In this case (the opposite of the electronic halide ballasts) this driving of the T5 overdrives them, since the bulbs the ballast is designed for use more current than T5s.

Electonic halide ballasts underdrive HQI bulbs - M80 ballasts drive them as they are designed to be driven.

 

[jwils27]

Roland Jacques;67195 wrote: If you a DIYer I have some extra t-5 HO 54watts Quiktronic ballast cheep.

how many do you have and how much for them. anyother information would be appreciated

 

[blind1993]

yea can u tell me also.

 

[skriz]

ok, so if an hqi ballast drives an hqi bulb as it should, then you will get a slight more mar (+14) and yellower color than you would with e-ballast, but you will use 25% more power! And that's just from the ballast; when you take into consideration the heat from the ballast that will need to be cooled, that number is higher.

 

[roland jacques]

jwils27;67283 wrote: how many do you have and how much for them. anyother information would be appreciated

I have a number of ballast briefly used. about 3 months or so
QTP 2x54 T-5HO/UNV PSN $20 each ($5 off 3rd 4th...)

Also some Dali (fully programmable Dimmable ballast) made in Switzerland.

Sylvania Quicktronic Professional Series( Maximum bulb life of any ballast)
T-5 HO Ballast, SOFT/rapid Start, Dimmable
60+ Months warranty.
Warranty expiers 27-04-2011

 

[kevinc]

Agreed. If anyone comes out with an electronic ballast designed to drive HQIs, I'll be all over it. Certainly electronic ballasts have advantages in heat and size. Whether or not you like a 14k bulb driven to look like a 20k bulb (like the Phoenix 14k bulb does on the Icecap) is a matter of preference. And whether or not you need the extra light output a HQI ballast provides, at the expense of lower efficiency and more heat, is another question.

Skriz;67287 wrote: ok, so if an hqi ballast drives an hqi bulb as it should, then you will get a slight more mar (+14) and yellower color than you would with e-ballast, but you will use 25% more power! And that's just from the ballast; when you take into consideration the heat from the ballast that will need to be cooled, that number is higher.