Emergency! Need Help!

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patrick214

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Ok so before I get into my problem ill describe my setup. I have a 215 gallon sps tank thats been setup around a year. I have all top of the line equipment bubble king skimmer, vortechs, chiller, phosphate reactor, uv sterilizer and the works. I have around 15 fish, 6 tangs, 4 anthias, and some other dwarf angels and such. A few days ago i noticed my tangs had come down w ick-a problem i havent had in around 4 months- and much worse than before. I immediately tested everything and all seemed well except nitrates. and they were off the charts with the salifert kit. This is ironic bc i just bought a denitrator to cope with my problems of 30-40 nitrates last week. I setup the denitrator around 5 days ago and moved 20-30 lbs of rubble rock from the end of the sump to right under the overflow into the sump to fit the denitrator. 3-4 days later i noticed my nitrates were the highest level on the chart. I've done two 50% changes in the past 3 days and they are still registering at 100 on my salifert kit. now originally i thought moving my rubble rock to under the overflow caused it to release alot of bound organics causing a large nitrate spike. but now after performing two 50% changes with no change in nitrates i'm beginning to suspect my DSB is crashing. today i lost a yellow tang, and dori looks terrible. Suprisingly my powder blue looks the best of any of the tangs. Essentially my questions are would rock be able to release this much nitrate (Wed 30-40) Sunday (100+)? If sandbeds crash do they release nitrates? and finally If my sandbed is crashing what option do i have to save my animals? Another note, My corals look better than ever, this is absolutely odd but they do and the sand has no H2S smell so i dont believe its sulfide.
 
I would try a carbon method slowly, actually very, very slowly! Get some AZ-NO3 overnighted to you. Start with 1/2 recommendation. Also, you will just have to continue with water changes. hummm........do you have any vodka?
 
make sure your denitrifier is working right also. Call or post to owner of company. ASAP!
 
As of right now i have 7 bags of purigen in my sump, and the denitrator is not the kind that is fed alcohol.
 
Do a 80% water change. I know you'll be taking out bacteria, but there should be plenty in your live rock & sand. tonight
 
Man, that's a tough one... You mention a DSB--is that in your tank or remote?

Is it a sulfer denitrator you're using? They can take a few weeks to start working, I think, so hopefully it will kick in soon. I hear that once they do, they can take care of nitrates pretty quickly.

But I'd be more worried about the source. With a great skimmer and good circulation, I wouldn't think that you would have had that much of a nitrate buildup. And I haven't heard of DSBs crashing after just a year anyways...

What about your LR? How much do you have? Did you get it fresh or did it come from a tank break-down? Sometimes LR can have a lot of Nitrate locked up in it that can leach out, but I don't know why it would do it so suddenly and at those levels...

All I can say is that you had high nitrates last week, but after the addition of a denitrator, they went through the roof. I would look for a link. Maybe someone with more experience with denitrators can chime in...

I would continue with the water changes and hope for the best. Just try not to shock your fish and corals with new salt water that hasn't been heated/adjusted properly. Good luck!
 
Patrick214;176686 wrote: As of right now i have 7 bags of purigen in my sump, and the denitrator is not the kind that is fed alcohol.
Click to expand...


is that reused or new?
 
jessezm;176690 wrote: Man, that's a tough one... You mention a DSB--is that in your tank or remote?

Is it a sulfer denitrator you're using? They can take a few weeks to start working, I think, so hopefully it will kick in soon. I hear that once they do, they can take care of nitrates pretty quickly.

But I'd be more worried about the source. With a great skimmer and good circulation, I wouldn't think that you would have had that much of a nitrate buildup. And I haven't heard of DSBs crashing after just a year anyways...

What about your LR? How much do you have? Did you get it fresh or did it come from a tank break-down? Sometimes LR can have a lot of Nitrate locked up in it that can leach out, but I don't know why it would do it so suddenly and at those levels...

All I can say is that you had high nitrates last week, but after the addition of a denitrator, they went through the roof. I would look for a link. Maybe someone with more experience with denitrators can chime in...

I would continue with the water changes and hope for the best. Just try not to shock your fish and corals with new salt water that hasn't been heated/adjusted properly. Good luck!
Click to expand...

I agree.......you need to do some massive water changes, but make sure it's calibrated and close as possible to temp. They can handle 5-10 degrees.
 
The DSB is a year old but has sand that is 2 years old from a previous setup in it. The denitrator is the H&S variety and it is sulfur based. I moved the rock where the sulfur reactor was and put under heavy flow into the sump this rubble was also from my previous setup. The purigen is some new some probably needs to be renewed. Im at an absolute loss.
 
I just bought a 1/2 hp chiller, denitrator, and a controller in the past week and the tanks about to fold.
 
I would unhook the dentrifier & talk to the manufacturer first to insure all is 100%. I would do massive water changes. I would get a carbon source for the time being like AZ-NO3 just to settle trates down. I hate to suggest this, but go to reefcentral.com & Post in the chemistry forum & Lighting, filtration, etc. forum to get a very quick response.

index.php
 
Man, ive spoke to some ppl about this, and im real confused what to do. Some ppl are saying to run a C-source to lower no3 and that its unlikely the sand bed is the culprit, and others are suggesting my sandbed is releasing nutrients. At this, point im leaning towards removing all the animals and removing the sandbed but its still up in the air. It really seems like a lose lose situation, and at this point my biggest concern is to save the fish.
 
the only thing that removing the sand bed can do if you are wrong, is raise nitrates (well, sort of).

It would not hurt to remove that sand bed in your situation & try other methods to lowering trates. It just seems like there is an association with the denitrifier & nitrates. At this point, we are all trying to help with some educated (& I guess, some uneducated) guesses. You will have to make the call. Try reefcentral yet? That would be one more source of info to help you make the call.
 
make sure you oxegen level is really good, too. Open some windows in your home.
 
If you can house the fish in a temporary system, then you should do that asap. It doesn't need a skimmer, lighting, etc. All it needs is the proper temp and circulation.

Second, I HIGHLY doubt it's your sand bed. If anybody's sandbed would crash, it would be mine, and mine has been grooving for years.

I would remove the denitrator, run some carbon and monitor the tank. If you have been doing massive water changes without making a dent in the situation, then I wouldn't continue with them. Wait and see. Usually, water changes can solve your problems. There are the rare few occasions where they will not help and is just a waste of time and money. Patience may pay off a little here, rather than the water changes.
 
face a powerhead up toward the surface of the water for a little "break"
 
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