We purchased a Green Mandarin from CBA over the weekend and he isn't eating anything we try to give him. Does he eat our food or does he get stuff from the bottom? If he needs to be fed what do they generally like? He appears healthy however the small brittle stars do not get along with him. They have managed to get his tail fin pretty bad, I think Ive got the main guy out, I'm trying to get the two smaller ones out.
Green Mandarin Eats What?
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Izib,
Ok let me be the first to sound like a jerk here (and believe me I do not mean it this way) but if I remember correctly, you just set up your tank not too long ago. A Mandarin is going to starve to death in your tank. Their main diet (and some can argue only substainable diet) is pods. Pods only come in live form and grow in numbers able to support a mandarin with an aged tank with plenty of live rock and a fuge to grow pods in! I will say that SOME mandarins will take prepared foods but IMHO there are the exception and the jury is still out as to if prepared food offer enough of what the mandarin needs in lue of pods. Some people feed live brin shrimp. While a Mandarin will eat them, they offer very little in the way of nutritional value to the fish. Even if you "enrich" the shrimp with an additive, like SelCon, evidence shows this is of little value.
So either a) your mandarin is not accepting prepared foods or b) your mandarin is not accepting prepared foods and something (illness) is wrong with him.
It is a shame LFS continue to sell such a fish to people knowing the slow and painful death that comes to the fish from keeping them. Even worse is they are a beautiful fish and the price point of $20 is tempting to many reefers!
Your only hope here, IMHO, is to get ahold of some pods and see if he will eat them like a fat kid eating cake! Then figure out a way to grow enough for him to eat his own weight in the bugs everyday! Or give him back to Cap Bay with a note about how sick you are that they would sell you such a fish without seeing if you had the system or the background on the fish to care for it!
Ok let me be the first to sound like a jerk here (and believe me I do not mean it this way) but if I remember correctly, you just set up your tank not too long ago. A Mandarin is going to starve to death in your tank. Their main diet (and some can argue only substainable diet) is pods. Pods only come in live form and grow in numbers able to support a mandarin with an aged tank with plenty of live rock and a fuge to grow pods in! I will say that SOME mandarins will take prepared foods but IMHO there are the exception and the jury is still out as to if prepared food offer enough of what the mandarin needs in lue of pods. Some people feed live brin shrimp. While a Mandarin will eat them, they offer very little in the way of nutritional value to the fish. Even if you "enrich" the shrimp with an additive, like SelCon, evidence shows this is of little value.
So either a) your mandarin is not accepting prepared foods or b) your mandarin is not accepting prepared foods and something (illness) is wrong with him.
It is a shame LFS continue to sell such a fish to people knowing the slow and painful death that comes to the fish from keeping them. Even worse is they are a beautiful fish and the price point of $20 is tempting to many reefers!
Your only hope here, IMHO, is to get ahold of some pods and see if he will eat them like a fat kid eating cake! Then figure out a way to grow enough for him to eat his own weight in the bugs everyday! Or give him back to Cap Bay with a note about how sick you are that they would sell you such a fish without seeing if you had the system or the background on the fish to care for it!
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I agree with Brandon wholeheartedly on this one. I understand they are a business and need to sell things, but selling something like this to someone and not advising them about their diet or care is not right in my book.
But the majority of the blame should go to the buyer. This is why impulse buys are a big no-no. If you want to buy something and don't know anything about it, then you should go home and research it first and find out if you have the proper environment and equipment to house the new addition and have him thrive and be happy. Then make your decision as to whether to buy it or not.
I'm not chastising you or anything, but this is a perfect example of what not to do. Knowledge is the key to a successful reef tank. Ignorance, impatience and impulse are the enemies.
No one should be buying anything and then posting on here asking how to take care of them. That's not responsible reefkeeping.
Please, in the future, be more mindful of what you are buying and know if your tank is capable of supporting it or not.
IMO, your best bet is to return the fish ASAP and tell them you don't have a suitable environment to support the mandarin.
Hopefully, this will help you better understand the needs of the livestock you buy and will enable you to provide the proper care for each of them, so they thrive and live a long and healthy life in your tank.
Good Luck.
But the majority of the blame should go to the buyer. This is why impulse buys are a big no-no. If you want to buy something and don't know anything about it, then you should go home and research it first and find out if you have the proper environment and equipment to house the new addition and have him thrive and be happy. Then make your decision as to whether to buy it or not.
I'm not chastising you or anything, but this is a perfect example of what not to do. Knowledge is the key to a successful reef tank. Ignorance, impatience and impulse are the enemies.
No one should be buying anything and then posting on here asking how to take care of them. That's not responsible reefkeeping.
Please, in the future, be more mindful of what you are buying and know if your tank is capable of supporting it or not.
IMO, your best bet is to return the fish ASAP and tell them you don't have a suitable environment to support the mandarin.
Hopefully, this will help you better understand the needs of the livestock you buy and will enable you to provide the proper care for each of them, so they thrive and live a long and healthy life in your tank.
Good Luck.
izib... i still have that sebae anenome for you, if you still want it. i will be in atlanta on saturday. Will be more then happy to also give you a cup full of pods to start to seed your tank..(as many as i can catch).. but i kinda also agree with the others, the madarin may not make it...
Thanks for the input guys.
Xyzpdg0121 - no offense taken, I consider it helpful advice.
The tank has actually been set up for about 5 years now, its just had a couple moves and a few not so good years. It also has plenty of LR and pods are everywhere after dark. Hopefully the little guy can get plenty to eat, hes an amazing fish (I now know its a he!).
Xyzpdg0121 - no offense taken, I consider it helpful advice.
The tank has actually been set up for about 5 years now, its just had a couple moves and a few not so good years. It also has plenty of LR and pods are everywhere after dark. Hopefully the little guy can get plenty to eat, hes an amazing fish (I now know its a he!).
My rock is well established, but my sand is very young. I am a bit worried my little guy is going to be struggling since I don't run a fuge so I plan on supplemental feeding myself. Fortunately, we can buy live pods from Aquabuys.com and pick them up directly. Good news is at night I see all kinds of pods swimming about course my current fish load for a 120 is very low.
Also the Mandarin myth is a bit over blown. They are more difficult to keep as they are difficult to feed non-live food, but a good keeper can overcome these obsticles with a little care. You just have to realize this is not a throw it in the tank and feed it flake food kind of fish.
In Brandons tank, I would be affraid one of the giant pods would eat him.
Also the Mandarin myth is a bit over blown. They are more difficult to keep as they are difficult to feed non-live food, but a good keeper can overcome these obsticles with a little care. You just have to realize this is not a throw it in the tank and feed it flake food kind of fish.
In Brandons tank, I would be affraid one of the giant pods would eat him.
Got your PM Sprayin70.
Thanks for the advice Cameron.
For everyone else, I hope my previous thread helped clear things up a little. I don't feel that cba did me wrong nor do I feel this is not responsible reef keeping on my part. Ive researched this fish as Ive done every other fish or invert Ive put in my tank. Part of the issue is that I researched him a year ago, my notes about him say that he eats pods primarily and that he is a delicate fish. However that being said I think we all know that some people have had great results with them, I'm sure there is someone out there who has kept one without any pods in the tank. I waited until I thought I had a large number of them, hence why hes the 2nd to last fish to go in the tank.
Yes I may have played dumb in my first post, I did this on purpose because I wanted a full array of answers. If I would have put what I knew I would have gotten fewer and less detailed answers. I wanted answers from people who have kept mandarins and had real experience with them.
Thanks for the advice Cameron.
For everyone else, I hope my previous thread helped clear things up a little. I don't feel that cba did me wrong nor do I feel this is not responsible reef keeping on my part. Ive researched this fish as Ive done every other fish or invert Ive put in my tank. Part of the issue is that I researched him a year ago, my notes about him say that he eats pods primarily and that he is a delicate fish. However that being said I think we all know that some people have had great results with them, I'm sure there is someone out there who has kept one without any pods in the tank. I waited until I thought I had a large number of them, hence why hes the 2nd to last fish to go in the tank.
Yes I may have played dumb in my first post, I did this on purpose because I wanted a full array of answers. If I would have put what I knew I would have gotten fewer and less detailed answers. I wanted answers from people who have kept mandarins and had real experience with them.
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This really doesn't make any sense to me whatsoever. Whether you posted you had taken notes a year ago about them eating pods or not, you still would have gotten the same answers from people who had experience with them. It would have eliminated my post and I wouldn't have taken the time and effort to write it, seeing that you had already done your research on them.
Kinda confused why you had to play dumb to get answers? You don't have to do that kind of thing here. Just post everything you know and you will get your answer quicker and with less hassle.
A lot of people outright say Mandarins are virtually impossible to keep. I have seen at least two that have been put into tanks for over a year and the owners didn't do anything special for them. I am not advocating this, but reefers tend to scare potential owners with starvation horror stories. I know your typical guy that stops by the fish store, buys one not knowing about how to care for it is asking for trouble.
Mandarins while sensitve to water changes and picky eaters are pretty hardy when it comes to disease and parasites. While I wouldn't say they are "easy" to keep, I wouldn't engage in scare tactics either.
I think I may take up the Mandarin Wiki mantle (along with some clam tips -- mmm, clam tips ... in wine sauce ...) since I've observed several good behaviors out of mine.
I got mine from CBA as well. They fed mine Cyclopeze and they probably did the same with yours, but best to ask. I have observed mine eating pods (plenty in a tank that's basically the 4th iteration of a 5+ year old setup), Cyclopeze, and http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=ON2615">Formual One (small pellets)</a>. The last I have fed using a technique suggested by Marc from the DFWMAS/Reefcast crew he dubbed the [IMG]http://www.melevsreef.com/mandarin_diner.html">Mandarin Diner</a>. The diner technique has been very successful, though you will also eventually be feeding the hermits. It keeps other fish out very well which is key for Mandarins because they are slow eaters.
In the past (a decade ago now), I had one of these beautiful fish that I did not successfully keep. It clearly didn't have sufficient food even in an established 125g reef and it wasted away. Nothing worse looking that a starving Mandarin. The area between their dorsal and pectoral fins begins to cave inward. I fell for an impulse purchase which I lacked the knowledge of how to keep.
One myth I would dispel is that you need to have a huge tank for these fish. I think that's a vestige of the pre-refugium years when such a tank was needed for ample nutrition. I think the key is having a sufficiently large refugium relative to the size of your display tank. I have a 15g fuge with a 5" DSB on my 25g that keeps my display tank nicely stocked with all kinds of bugs.
I think a good piece of advice when buying ANY fish is to inquire about not only what the fish eats "normally" but what it's eating in the store. Don't ask "What does it eat?" ask "What are you feeding it?". A good store can confirm diet and then it is up to the buyer to decide if he/she can supply at least that food until confirmation of other possibilities.
I got mine from CBA as well. They fed mine Cyclopeze and they probably did the same with yours, but best to ask. I have observed mine eating pods (plenty in a tank that's basically the 4th iteration of a 5+ year old setup), Cyclopeze, and http://www.marinedepot.com/md_viewItem.asp?idproduct=ON2615">Formual One (small pellets)</a>. The last I have fed using a technique suggested by Marc from the DFWMAS/Reefcast crew he dubbed the [IMG]http://www.melevsreef.com/mandarin_diner.html">Mandarin Diner</a>. The diner technique has been very successful, though you will also eventually be feeding the hermits. It keeps other fish out very well which is key for Mandarins because they are slow eaters.
In the past (a decade ago now), I had one of these beautiful fish that I did not successfully keep. It clearly didn't have sufficient food even in an established 125g reef and it wasted away. Nothing worse looking that a starving Mandarin. The area between their dorsal and pectoral fins begins to cave inward. I fell for an impulse purchase which I lacked the knowledge of how to keep.
One myth I would dispel is that you need to have a huge tank for these fish. I think that's a vestige of the pre-refugium years when such a tank was needed for ample nutrition. I think the key is having a sufficiently large refugium relative to the size of your display tank. I have a 15g fuge with a 5" DSB on my 25g that keeps my display tank nicely stocked with all kinds of bugs.
I think a good piece of advice when buying ANY fish is to inquire about not only what the fish eats "normally" but what it's eating in the store. Don't ask "What does it eat?" ask "What are you feeding it?". A good store can confirm diet and then it is up to the buyer to decide if he/she can supply at least that food until confirmation of other possibilities.
<span style="color: black;">I agree. They are very hardy and most do quite well in an established tank. I successfully kept a mandarin in my 72g tank. It stayed very healthy and I was fortunate that it began to take frozen foods that had been soaked in vitamins. I was never a consistent feeder some I'm sure it didn't survive because of the food I offered. I did tons of research and provided the best environment possible for its survival.</span>
i've had my "pyscho" delic mandarin for almost 3 years. Fat and happy as can be. He has never touched any of the food i have ever put into the tank, from pellets, flakes, shrimp, scallops to nori.. he constantly hovers around looking for pods...I think this is the biggest key to making sure they survive...this is the one fish i have that i dont have to worry about feeding when im away on vacation..
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The reason I questioned your statement is that I dissagree that mis-information is being propagated regarding the Mandarin. Most of the information I have seen is right on. They are difficult, if not impossible fish to keep long term if you don't provide the proper environment for them as are many marine animals. I do agree with your satement that they are very hardy fish. In my years of keeping them, I lost the first one to a Rio pump explosion and the second to the carpet, never one to disease. The current 2 have been living happily in my current system for several months. They are wonderful fish but they do have special needs.
