Nano CUC discussion

[jdavid]

Just wanted to hear some of your thoughts and opinions on a strong clean up crew for a nano tank. What works for you? I know I have not given this enough thought in the past. I just set up a 29 biocube, and picked 6 good sized blue legs and one large nassarius snail off my rock in my LR holding tank. I know I had some snails on there! I just have to take the rock out and find them. But I am going to have to purchase a strong crew, even after finding what I have. Tell me about your favorite members of your clean up crew.

Here are some points I have been thinking over, if you would like to comment

Small tank, Large crew. An advantage to having a small tank is being able to overstock the CUC. What are the disadvantages to overstocking?

Large numbers, small critters. There are some hard to reach spaces in a reef tank. The little guys count. Dwarf ceriths, small crabs? Who gets to the small spaces?

Algae. Eat it before it gets out of control. Are invertebrates alone enough, or must one consider a fish for the clean up crew. What fish that eat algae are recommended for a small tank.

Bulldozers. Sure turbo snails are GREAT. But they knock stuff over. Does one or more have a home in your nano tank?

The sandbed. Burrowers are great for turning sand over, but am I going to get a predator instead of a harmless snail? Is a sandsifting starfish bad for the biodiversity of a sandbed?

Crabs. Are free roaming crabs bad news? Sure they eat algae, but they can hunt and kill precious snails. Why do we keep them anyway? What can they do that snails can't? Are extra shells in the tank the solution to snail hunting? Any reason you wouldn't keep a large crab, like an emerald? Are omnivores necessary? Who eats the left over meaty foods if you don't have hermit crabs?

Plants. Many nano tanks are AIO with a refugium section included. It's valuable space. many keep a skimmer there. What about macroalgae. Are they really any good at filtration? Or are they a waste of space where a valuable skimmer or denitrifying media should be.

Odd critters. Sea cucumbers, urchins, nudibrachs and the like. What are your odd critters, and why do you keep them?

Stuff you didn't buy. Some of my best CUC members in my 8g nano hitchhiked in and reproduced. I have some stomatella snails nearing 1" long. When they were younger, I never thought they would become so big! Micro stars as well. I will be adding both to my 29. What do you appreciate in your clean up crew that you didn't buy?

Anything you have to say about CUCs would be valuable information, whether it pertains specifically to a nano tank, or not. Thanks

 

[ivegotcrabs]

Tagging along. I just swapped to a 29 myself

 

[fishdude]

I've got three fish in my 29. I feed pellet twice a day and a cube of frozen every third day and not a spot of algae. The over feeding is mostly for coral then the fish. I've got 20 mixed crabs/15 snails/10 sand sifting snails. The tank is very old and the biodiversity is huge. IMO Must haves for a CUC in this size tank: one emerald to keep bubble algae in check, sand sifting crew (1 gobie or 1 starfish or 10 snails). The best algae eaters I've seen are urchins but like turbos they knock a lot of stuff over. I'm also a big fan of Lawnmower Blennys, they eat hair algae and are cool to watch.

 

[jdavid]

Fishdude;886711 wrote: I've got three fish in my 29. I feed pellet twice a day and a cube of frozen every third day and not a spot of algae. The over feeding is mostly for coral then the fish. I've got 20 mixed crabs/15 snails/10 sand sifting snails. The tank is very old and the biodiversity is huge. IMO Must haves for a CUC in this size tank: one emerald to keep bubble algae in check, sand sifting crew (1 gobie or 1 starfish or 10 snails). The best algae eaters I've seen are urchins but like turbos they knock a lot of stuff over. I'm also a big fan of Lawnmower Blennys, they eat hair algae and are cool to watch.

Thanks for the input. I think you might have made a good decision going with burrowing Nassarius snails rather than a goby or a starfish. I have read that they basically just eat the guys who keep the sandbed in check (microworms etc). I can see how this would be less of a problem in a larger tank.

I own a small emerald crab as well. He might make the cut in the 29

 

[tbub1221]

ill throw my 2 cents in here , i think as far as substrate stirrers go , a sand sifter star and nassarius are a good bet , i have 5 nassarius and a unknown conch (it has a foot it can kick and jumps it climes over rocks by jumping sometimes , so cool) he burrows a lot as well but this is because i have about a 2.5-3" sand bed of about 35 lbs so its important to keep it stirred the sand sifter is by far the best for this.The big turbos are like you said , clumsy big jurks that knock frags over , i had 2 i put in to eat diatom after my cycle , but once it was goen they starved and died so unless you have a lot of diatom id keep them off the list.
i have aprox 15-20 crabs 1 emerald one sally light foot and the rest are different size and type of hermit , theyt all eat and do different things (ill let you reed about that if your interested, i wont bore you with what white, red and blue crabs eat lol) i have red and blue leg , 2 scarlets black and white claws and white hermets to name a few. snails are the same way , they all do a different job , about 30+ nerite or tapestry/ or both mixed make up a good glass cleaning crue , the crabs will pick rocks clean. if your looking in to a fish that will eat hair algea lawnmowers are good , but can run in to the same issue as the big turbo snails, its really difficult to get them eating processed food so they starve .
also tuxedo urchens are great for cleaning rock and glass and is small and reef safe.
if i was stocking another 29 knowing what i know now id get yourself about 45-50 small snails , and crabs mixing up what you have , you wont see them all all the time , the snails are mainly night folk as you know so it wont look like to much.
i forgot to mention my shrimp , they do a good job picking at stuff also , the peppermint are good , my pistol shrimp keeps all the under rock work area spick and span , sometimes i purposely push rocks an shells in his hole just to piss him off , he loks like a lil bulldozed pushing stuff around , so under my rocks is probably the cleanest area.
check this out , good info on who does what in the reef tank.
http://www.bluezooaquatics.com/resources.asp?show=21">http://www.bluezooaquatics.com/resources.asp?show=21</a>

Edit: this is also a good reforence for what eats what . hope it helps.
http://www.reefcleaners.org/index.php?option=com_virtuemart&page=shop.browse&category_id=4&Itemid=58

 

[jdavid]

Thanks Terry, I actually did notice one of the larger hermits is a scarlet and forgot to mention my large cleaner shrimp will be going in the 29.

I am thinking that the crabs that I have in there already (has actually got to be more than 5 or 6, I was just dropping them in there, but they are all over the rocks climbing around) may be enough if not too mant. I might be trying to stay away from having too many crabs. Not because I don't like seeing them, I do, but because I think snails are more important. Crabs kill snails. I haven't actually had an issue with that in the past, but I have done some reading. All the crabs that I put in there are large, but I have ten or so little bitty blue legs that can go too if needed.

What do you guys think of http://www.reefcleaners.org/index.php?page=shop.product_details&flypage=flypage_new.tpl&product_id=222&category_id=20&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=34">this snail crew</a> to start off?

Thanks for the link I'm gonna check that out

 

[tbub1221]

That's a bunch of snails 4 the money , buying from a LfS would get you less than 1/3 of that.

 

[dball711]

Good topic and something I have just changed my thoughts on. I have always had just a handful of snails, emeralds and hermits. Recently I decided to go with a much larger clean up crew in each tank. I had a 6 gal nanocube that was starting to get an abundance of green slime algae so I shifted a bunch of snails (Nassarius Vibex, Dwarf Cerith, Nerite, Zig Zag Periwinkle) and hermits (assorted but mostly blue leg), about 25 snails and 15-20 hermits into the tank. It took about 1 week and they completely eradicated all traces of algae.

About then I placed an order with Reef Cleaners for about 300 assorted snails and hermits (received about 800 snails and hermits). Just split them up among my 3 tanks and I still have to wipe my glass weekly but the rock work is completely void of any algae. I am now a firm believer in an oversized clean up crew.

I have a few frag racks in the tank and when I see any unwanted growth, I just slide the rack sown to the sand bed and snails and hermits swarm the rack till its spotless. Nothing worse than frags with unwanted algae.

I like the snail crew you selected but I would add more to it, you wont be charged more for shipping unless you add something that need an overnight shipping. Dwarf Ceriths and Zig Zags are $0.15, I'd also bump the Nertis and Florida Ceriths (both are breeding in my tanks). most likely you will receive more than you order, they are very generous. Be warned that some are small, very small but the do work hard. I know your on a budget but if you can spring for overnight shipping, their blue leg and assorted hermits are great. I got a bunch of white leg hermits in my last order and they are real good cleaners.

My 2 cents, hope it helps...

 

[bulkrate]

Variety carries the day, especially in small tanks. A mix of snails that target your problem areas (Nerites/astreas prefer grazing on glass & rock, ceriths tend to hug the sandbed); Nassarius/dwarf hermits to mop up uneaten food; micro brittle starfish or bristleworms to scrub through the crevices of your live rock.

I've become partial to banded trochus in place of turbos - much better at maneuvering over & around stuff without bulldozing, hermit crab resistant, self-righting. They eat a bit less, but make up for it in my opinion.