Oddity between Apex Classic and New Fusion

[FutureInterest]

So... on the tank with the Apex I had to replace the classic and get a new fusion. Btw, if you need one go to @atlantaaquarium . Get it same day and he'll give you a lil something for your trouble...

Anyways, I have 4 250 watt heaters that register at 10 amps on the new fusion eb832 whereas before they only pulled 5 amps before. I was forced to use both the eb832 and the eb8 simply because the eb832 kept going over 15 amps with lights, pumps, and heaters. This tripped the Apex over and over again. I first discovered this anomoly when I came home to a tank in emergency mode. Fortunately my vortech battery backup kicked in and I had a random powerhead on a different power strip as well. I never had this issue with the classic eb8. Which could handle all of the above and keep me around 11-12 amps with everything on. So I moved the heaters to the eb8 after connecting them and low and behold they still just pull 5 amps when turned on.

I'm not quite sure why this is the case... but it does go to show newer isn't necessarily better I also miss that lil head unit on the classic.

 

[danh]

I definitely didn't miss that head unit... but I am pretty sure you can buy one for the new one.

 

[lmm1967]

hmmm - that's odd. I'd think about having that eb832 checked out some how.

I have a new Apex, 2 EB832 plus 2 EB8 (this apex runs 3 complete tank set ups) all on a single 15 AMP circuit with GFI and I have never tripped a breaker or the GFI.

Each tank has a heater, a DC return pump, 2 tanks have DC skimmer pumps, 1 tank has 2 Kessils & 4' 4 bulb T5, 1 tank has my DIY LED fixture, a total of 4 medium sized powerbeads, 2 Gyre 230, each tank has a 24 volt ATO pump.

 

[enderg60]

Get a kill-a-watt and see who's lying. They are like $15 or if youre lucky your local library may have one to loan out.

 

[Adam]

@futureinterest I have a Killawatt I can loan you if you want to see what the true draw of everything is.

@lmm1967 That's quite a lot on a single 15amp circuit (15amp x 120v = 1800w). I believe a 15amp GFCI can go over it's rated current without tripping, they aren't breakers per say. They measure the difference in load to neutral and trip if there's an imbalance, ground fault. But circuit breakers can and do go bad and they're usually designed to carry 80% (1440w) of their rating for continuous loads... but... they can handle 125% (2250w) of their rating for 3hrs before tripping. The exception is if they're BR 100% duty rated, then there is no 80/125% as part of their cert and can only go up to 15amp/1800w. BR breakers are rare in residential and would normally be put in by an owner in error. Also, you can't just up the breaker size to 20amp unless the wiring for that circuit is 12ga or thicker. If you have 14ga (common) or 16ga (uncommon) wiring to that circuit it can't handle the extra load. You very well may not be pulling up to 2250 watts on that circuit for any length of time, you'd have to total up all the watts for the equipment and divide by 120 to get your amp draw.
In the middle of the load time, when lights, pumps and heaters are all on, you should check to see if the actual breaker and house wiring for the circuit are hot. If the wires look damaged from heat or are too hot to touch you've got a potential problem.

I'm not an electrician, but wired my basement myself when I finished it and it was inspected to code by the city. I also ran two new circuits to the fish room before setting up my system but I knew I was going to need it. 1100w in heaters & up to 1250w in lighting alone. That doesn't include 3 pumps, 6 powerheads, 2 QT's and whatever other stuff is plugged in! lol

I can link you to more info on it if your interested.

 

[FutureInterest]

Aye Adam, I think that might be good to check. I still need to return your loaner apex. I'm back in town tonight so I'll swing by tomorrow when you're available.

Thanks guys. I'm impressed with the amount of knowledge here.

 

[Adam]

Aye Adam, I think that might be good to check. I still need to return your loaner apex. I'm back in town tonight so I'll swing by tomorrow when you're available.

Thanks guys. I'm impressed with the amount of knowledge here.

I'll be around tonight and till about noon tomorrow. After that I won't be back till Wednesday.

 

[lmm1967]

@futureinterest I have a Killawatt I can loan you if you want to see what the true draw of everything is.

@lmm1967 That's quite a lot on a single 15amp circuit (15amp x 120v = 1800w). I believe a 15amp GFCI can go over it's rated current without tripping, they aren't breakers per say. They measure the difference in load to neutral and trip if there's an imbalance, ground fault. But circuit breakers can and do go bad and they're usually designed to carry 80% (1440w) of their rating for continuous loads... but... they can handle 125% (2250w) of their rating for 3hrs before tripping. The exception is if they're BR 100% duty rated, then there is no 80/125% as part of their cert and can only go up to 15amp/1800w. BR breakers are rare in residential and would normally be put in by an owner in error. Also, you can't just up the breaker size to 20amp unless the wiring for that circuit is 12ga or thicker. If you have 14ga (common) or 16ga (uncommon) wiring to that circuit it can't handle the extra load. You very well may not be pulling up to 2250 watts on that circuit for any length of time, you'd have to total up all the watts for the equipment and divide by 120 to get your amp draw.
In the middle of the load time, when lights, pumps and heaters are all on, you should check to see if the actual breaker and house wiring for the circuit are hot. If the wires look damaged from heat or are too hot to touch you've got a potential problem.

I'm not an electrician, but wired my basement myself when I finished it and it was inspected to code by the city. I also ran two new circuits to the fish room before setting up my system but I knew I was going to need it. 1100w in heaters & up to 1250w in lighting alone. That doesn't include 3 pumps, 6 powerheads, 2 QT's and whatever other stuff is plugged in! lol

I can link you to more info on it if your interested.

so my "fish room" is actually our dining room. It's on it's own circuit and the lead in electrical starts out in my sump room which is under our staircase. I was lucky that when I opened that space up I was able to identify the inbound wiring. It's all 14ga Romex. I was able to cut the wiring (breaker turned off if any one is going to try this), wire in a GFI which protects all the outlets downstream. So nothing is plugged directly in to the GFCI but all the outlets in the room that I have aquarium stuff plugged in to is protected by the GFCI.

The breaker is the builder installed 15 AMP breaker. with the wiring basically exposed in my sump room I do have good access to the wires - none are even warm to the touch luckily.

I do need to go through and add up all the "stuff" and see what everything being turned on all at once would be. So far - knock on wood - no issues.

One thing I do worry about is I don't have any type of surge protection on that circuit right now - I'm thinking I need one of those whole home protectors considering all the tanks and electronics we have. I also am hoping we don't have another lengthy power outage this winter - running 2 tanks on my generator was fine - running 4 would be more of a challenge. Man - I really need to just build a house from scratch one of these days.

 

[Adam]

One thing I do worry about is I don't have any type of surge protection on that circuit right now - I'm thinking I need one of those whole home protectors considering all the tanks and electronics we have. I also am hoping we don't have another lengthy power outage this winter - running 2 tanks on my generator was fine - running 4 would be more of a challenge. Man - I really need to just build a house from scratch one of these days.

I use these on the outlets in the fish room. Not the best to look at in a dining room though...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00006B81D/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Since you have easy access, maybe a wired surge protector in the "Sump room" just for that circuit.

 

[lmm1967]

Those look interesting. The only way you can tell it's a dining room is because there is a light hanging from the ceiling in the middle of the room.

The only things in there are aquariums. And Tisha's elliptical

And now that I think about it - there are actually 3 lights hanging from the ceiling but 2 of them are over tanks.

 

[seand]

Jin, I can do you one better I have an amp loop if you want me to bring it next time I come