Skimmers for a 185g

[cameron]

This was my reply to someone asking about a good skimmer for their 185g. I typed enough that I thought someone else might be interested in reading it or filling in some blanks that I may have missed:

Here are your choices:

ATI BM250 - Latest technology, In Sump, Plug and Go, Can handle a 250g system easily - $770

Orca - Custom built, mesh modded for you, Recirc design, plug and go, can handle a 200g system - $430

Orca - Custom built, mesh modded, recirc design, plug and go, at least 500g - $840

DAS EX2 - Deltec design, recirc, plug and go, 200g - $400

DAS EX3 - Deltec design, recirc, plug and go, 300g - $630

AquaEuro Classic 400 - in sump, requires some modding to extract performance, 150g no mods, 250g+ with mods - $240 stock up to $500 modded

AquaEuro AE265 - recirc design, requires some modding to extract performance, 120g no mods, 250g+ with mods - $270 stock up to $550 modded

Octopus Dual Recirc 150 - recirc design, plug and go, 200g - $390

Octopus Dual Recirc 250 - recirc design, plug and go, 250g - $500

Octopus Triple Recirc 300 - recird deisgn, plug and go, 250g+ - $650

To me these are the best of the bang for buck skimmers.

The ATI is pulling probably more air than any listed. This doesn't mean it is the best, but it is a really good indicator. I certainly know it is spoken in terms of performance alongside the BubbleKing and Deltec skimmers which is really good company.

The Orca line is pretty hard to ignore. The guy basically builds a skimmer to suit your needs and uses the latest design technology to do it (true union cup fittings, flanged top for easy cleaning, bubble baffles, top of the line acrylic, etc). He can use any pump you want as well including the excellent Das knockoff of the AquaBee. He can build them any height and pretty much any width as well.

DAS skimmers are on the surface to me a fantastic idea. They licensed the older models from Deltec and started building clones right down to the pump. Basically you are buying a Deltec that is a few years old in design but with all new parts. Old Deltecs are still some of the best skimmers out there and the pumps are fantastic. Now these Das knock off pumps aren't as good as a new AquaBee Deltec, but they are still awesome pumps especially when you consider the cost. The problem comes in when something breaks as support has been very weak. Also, the acrylic used in their manufactoring is mid-grade leading to long term durability issues. Lastly, shipping from one of the few places you can buy one in the U.S. has been troublesome.

Now onto the next contender the AquaEuro USA skimmer. Both skimmers are hampered by a weak pump, but at half the price of most of the skimmers listed you are getting some down right great performance for the money. If you could mod these pumps for more performance, then they would be a steal but modding doesn't seem to help much. So basically you are into buying additional pumps, modding them yourself and cranking the skimmer up into the great performer range yourself. The good news is you can do this relatively cheaply and easily. If you buy the DAS knock off pumps which will cost you about $240 for two, you will basically be in the awesome skimmer category for around $500. If you buy 2-3 GenX pumps at $100-$150 and mesh mod, you will be in the really great skimmer department. There are a dozen other pumps you can buy and throw on a mesh mod to extract performance from these skimmers and you don't have to be in a huge rush to do it since day one these will give you OK performance. Aside from that the build quality is excellent and the acrylic is about as solid as it gets. My only real beef with the AE265 skimmer is it isn't as well though out as the others listed. Cleaning the main body is a pain, the intake nozzle could have been better designed as well and the way the pumps join to the body isn't effecient. However, we are talking about a skimmer than is 30-70% less than any skimmer listed above as well.

The final skimmers in my picks are the Octopus skimmers. These things work that is all that needs to be said for them. They use a EuroReef style design with an OceanRunner knock off pump. Not only do they fall into the affordable range you can also mesh mod the pumps easily and create some very good performing skimmers without paying a dime more. Without this mod, they will work just fine however with it they start approaching some of the top of the line skimmers in performance. Additionally the build quality of the octopus skimmers are very good. Acrylic is top notch as well as the assembly of the unit. The Dual 250 is very similar to the AE265 right down to my negatives. The Dual 200 and Triple 300 are much better thought out.

So had I $800 and didn't mind spending the cash, it is hard to pass up on the ATI. If I was more budget minded, I would probably go with the Orca. I like the DAS concept, but I worry about long term durability especially after plunking down that kind of cash. If I am budget strapped and don't mind DIY, the AEs are probably the best IMO. If I am on a budget and just want to plug and go, the Octopus skimmers are a tough model to walk away from as well.

Good news is you probably can't go wrong with any of the skimmers I listed.

 

[wbholwell]

What great info, Cameron! +1! I vote we add this to the wiki.

What about something similar for tanks 75 to 125 gal? Or are there too many choices?

 

[theplatypus]

No love for Beckett skimmers?

 

[cameron]

In the sub 100g category you start running into all sorts of skimmers including the TurboFlotors, more Octopus skimmers, etc. The 120g-ish market is a bit more selective and my picks don't change much from the DAS skimmers to Orca and finally the AEs. Even the $550 ATI BM200 is a great pick if you have the cash.

There are always the EuroReefs, Deltecs, etc but all are out IMO when bang for buck starts getting thrown around.

 

[purplegorilla]

Hey, nice posts. But here is one thing that I am a little confuse about..So a skimmer is rated for 200 gal, and you have a 180 gal tank. What about the volume in the Sump, Refugium, etc...Because I do have a 180 and bought the DAS EX2 but I didnt' feel that it is skimming enough since the volume from my large sump and fuge (probably another 140 or so) so I ended up putting another Skimmer in just to be safe..LOL

 

[cameron]

theplatypus;59498 wrote: No love for Beckett skimmers?

Becketts are out for me in the bang for buck category because you are going to pay in the long term for the generally large pumps required to push them. Looking at an MRC3 using a recommended Blue Line 55 you get a pump that consumes 180w compared to most of the ones below that are around 120w or less. The MRC with GenX pump is $555 at 170w. In the day, becketts were a good deal because needlewheels just couldn't perform as well. Now needlewheels set the benchmark on performance in terms of bubble size and quantity. I will put any skimmer I listed against an MRC3 skimmer (assuming you count modded AEs) and bet on them as a winner. Past that you get into noise issues and more frequent cleaning with becketts which may or may not be an issue for some.

 

[cameron]

I think the Korallen Zucht skimmers are over priced, but I have heard the Aqua-Excels are great but nobody seems to be able to find a reliable shipper. I have a shipper from China if I knew where to buy them. I would try one out.

 

[cameron]

ASM prices went up, acrylic is sub-par by comparison to others on the list (it is very thin) and they haven't evolved the design since they originally came out. They were once what Octopus and AE are today but like Big D said there are simply better choices. The ones I listed all are top performers in the price to performace ratings... ASM just doesn't compete there anymore... at least considering new units anyway.

 

[cameron]

BTW, when I count water volume on a tank I generally only count chambers that actually grow stuff. If you sink live rock in every chamber, then it is the total water volume. However if you only have a tank and fuge with stuff in it then I would only count the fuge and tank. I have a lot of water volume in the skimmer, canister filter, UV filter, return chamber of the sump, etc that I don't count toward skimmer size. There really isn't anything to skim in those departments at least not enough to really worry about.

 

[cameron]

If I didn't have the fuge in the sump, I wouldn't count the entire water mass. At some point you will want to count how fast the water turns over in the skimmer which simply means buying a skimmer for 90g might not work as the poop won't get to the skimmer in a timely matter with that much water. Since your examples water volume is so much greater than the bio-load if I were looking for a skimmer, I could easily get by with a skimmer with an actual rating of 120g or 150g as the bioload is very low for that much volume. If I went with a smaller skimmer in your example, I would probably avoid a recirc design as they don't pump as much water through the skimmer. A good NW200 would do a good job in your example where the same skimmer on a 90g with a 50g fuge and 20g of return/skimmer space would be seriously pushing the limit of that skimmer even though the total water volume is less.

I guess my point is you have to consider more than just water volume when looking at a skimmer and the point I am assuming you were about to make with your example is that you can't just look at the bio-load either.

 

[mufret]

There is really a lot that you should consider when choosing a skimmer (water volume, bioload - current and planned, amount of live rock, other forms of filtration, etc, etc.....) and that is why it's usually advisable that you choose a skimmer that is a bit larger (gives you a little flexibility if you didn't consider everything!). The conservative approach is to actually choose a skimmer that will skim your entire water volume as the biodiversity will ultimately migrate to all areas of your system. You will have things growing in your overflows and all areas of your sump.

 

[mufret]

Bleedingthought;59640 wrote:

As with just about everything in this hobby, there is not just one correct answer! :confused2:

 

[cameron]

I am still sticking with bioload as the big determining factor with water volume effecting the flow rate moreso through a skimmer.

 

[mufret]

Cameron;59774 wrote: I am still sticking with bioload as the big determining factor with water volume effecting the flow rate moreso through a skimmer.

That is certainly a valid point, on a static system. In my opinion, and it is only that, I would think that it's somewhat problematic to pick a skimmer based on "bioload". The bioload of our closed systems are in constant flux so do you pick the skimmer based on what you currently have in the tank (knowing that it IS going to change) or do you estimate what it could possibly be? We all hope our livestock is going to thrive which means that they will grow and add to our system's bioload. Do you factor in the the feeding schedule and requirements of your livestock (or how heavy handed some of us get while feeding)? Will that change over time?

Those are just a few of the questions that need to be answered as you narrow your choice of skimmers. Deciding on a skimmer is somewhat problematic because there are so many choices and there are so many things that have an impact on how effectively the one we pick will operate. That being said, to make an informed decision, you need to take a look at your setup and where you see it going. We purchase quite a few items for this hobby, and life in general, that allow us a bit of headroom and there's no reason we should think differently when we are looking to purchase a skimmer.

 

[cameron]

This is a good point that was brought up in a PM by someone else as well. Once you are plopping down for one of these big skimmers does spending another $100 or so to get a bigger than needed skimmer make sense? I think yes because if you ever upgrade you aren't going to be selling your new skimmer for half the price and picking up another larger skimmer when you could just spend a few extra bucks and got a big one to begin with. Having a skimmer that effectively skims a 250g on a 185g tank certainly doesn't hurt and most of the time isn't that much more. If you ever make the jump by adding a bigger fuge or moving to a larger tank, you won't be out any extra money as the skimmer with keep on running.

All that said though in his example if you are looking at almost 250 gallons of water with only 90 with any real bioload, you could just buy a $170 non-recirc skimmer line the NW200 and it would run that load just fine. Course that is an extreme example. I usually just tell people to add the main tank and fuge together to get the number they NEED not necessarily want. Trying to run down the extra 15 gallons in the return area, skimmer section, filters, etc probably isn't worth the effort when determining the minimum skimmer to look at.