Does anyone use kalk in their ATO For large tanks? For reference, my total water volume is probably around 600g, my ATO is a 20g tank. I currently have to dose extremely large amounts of two part to maintain parameters. Does anyone use kalk to maintain levels and then I assume use 2 part for supplemental dosing?
Using kalk for large tanks?
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I have one main rule when dosing Kalk - have a fail safe in place to kill the dose if pH get's out of whack. When set up a kalk reactors, I run the power to an Apex outlet that's programmed to shut off if the pH get's over 8.6. I would be very hesitant to run any sort of kalk without some sort of fail safe.
A lot of folks do add kalk to their ATO but I've never done it. My biggest concern is the annual fluctuation in ATO water usage. I go through a lot more RODI when it's cold out and the air is dryer. In my case, the kalk dose would be quite a bit more in the cooler months that it would be when it gets more humid and I don't need as much top off water.
Plus, I don't think there's a good way to know exactly how much kalk is dosed per mL if the solution isn't saturated. I suppose you could do it where you add X amount of kalk per gallon of water and that would give you a good idea. All you'd have to do is mix if up every time you add top off water.
A lot of folks do add kalk to their ATO but I've never done it. My biggest concern is the annual fluctuation in ATO water usage. I go through a lot more RODI when it's cold out and the air is dryer. In my case, the kalk dose would be quite a bit more in the cooler months that it would be when it gets more humid and I don't need as much top off water.
Plus, I don't think there's a good way to know exactly how much kalk is dosed per mL if the solution isn't saturated. I suppose you could do it where you add X amount of kalk per gallon of water and that would give you a good idea. All you'd have to do is mix if up every time you add top off water.
I know this is about kalk, but at 600g, you should be investing in a calc reactor. It will be way more efficient assuming you have a reef tank.
I have looked into the calcium but was trying to hold off at the time mostly due to equipment cost and having no experience with it
I run the largest MRC kalk reactor - I have it controlled like @jcook54 suggested with my APEX. I also have it pour into my Clarisea in case any chunks get through in the tubing as another level of protection. I have the motor programmed to turn on and off with the APEX and my pH swings from 8.10 to 8.26 with max being set to 8.30 with a typical .10 swing from morning to night daily. It works like a charm. APEX pulls water from my ATO into my reactor as needed. It is so larger rarely have to refill the kalk. And I run a combined 500+ gallons in both systems it feeds. I use this in combination with All for Reef and in keeps everything where it needs to be for the most part and corals seem happy. Just for the record I would never recommend running kalk in your ATO. With APEX or other dosers and all the automation available, you can run kalk easily with no need to risk your ATO. You can precisely control and fine tune when using a reactor, or even a bucket slurry method for kalk slurry as well.
So for kalk, I would definitely dose it with the units I’m currently using for sodium bicarbonate. The way I see it is that kalk would be cheaper and last longer for the price. Does this sound like a good plan? Or just stick with two part?
phishfoodie
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For a tank that large without a reactor, you would be mixing and dosing a very large amount. Without a reactor with some kind of automation, I think this would be very labor intensive.
Here's my honest take - Setting up a separate kalk reactor and fine tuning with the 2 parts would get the job done for a while. But I would do it like @sharis100 and have it controllable to avoid any overdosing. I would avoid adding kalk to the ATO because it's just so inconsistent. You'd always be messing with the 2 part dose when the concentration and/or ATO water level fluctuates.
My plan is to do just that. I have a single Kamoer dosing pump that I got for $100 and a used kalk reactor that I pick up here on ARC for $50. I already have the Apex to control that outlet so my cost to set one up is pretty minimal. Do you have any sort of controller that could monitor pH levels and kill the power if it get's too high? If not, that would be the most expensive part of setting up something similar.
My plan is to do just that. I have a single Kamoer dosing pump that I got for $100 and a used kalk reactor that I pick up here on ARC for $50. I already have the Apex to control that outlet so my cost to set one up is pretty minimal. Do you have any sort of controller that could monitor pH levels and kill the power if it get's too high? If not, that would be the most expensive part of setting up something similar.
Strongly suggest some sort of controller for more precise dialed in kalk to avoid possible catastrophe.
Kalk has a higher pH vs the soda ash in 2-part. The more the coral grows out the more 2-part or you're going to go through. Without a controller looking at your pH it would be much easier to have an unintended spike, which will always happen when your on vacation or away from the house for a few days.
There are a couple of older Classic Apex's for sale and they would be a good way to get started with one on the cheap.
I will have 2-part chemicals on hand to make occasional adjustments when needed but I will be using a Kalk stirrer to start then moving up to a reactor. When, at some point way in the future, that the Kalk alone can't keep up with demand I will use a CARX to fill the gap.
Everyone has their own preference on how they handle their systems. Some like the daily interaction of dosing and other maintenance. For me personally, I can't see how I could manage a large system without a controller. My schedule is just too crazy. Well that and I have a great memory, too bad it's just short
. A controller has many different roles it fills but one of the biggest is saving me from myself. At a certain point when there are thousands of dollars of livestock in a display the cost of a controller becomes a moot point given the levels of redundancy they give you.
There are a couple of older Classic Apex's for sale and they would be a good way to get started with one on the cheap.
I will have 2-part chemicals on hand to make occasional adjustments when needed but I will be using a Kalk stirrer to start then moving up to a reactor. When, at some point way in the future, that the Kalk alone can't keep up with demand I will use a CARX to fill the gap.
Everyone has their own preference on how they handle their systems. Some like the daily interaction of dosing and other maintenance. For me personally, I can't see how I could manage a large system without a controller. My schedule is just too crazy. Well that and I have a great memory, too bad it's just short
. A controller has many different roles it fills but one of the biggest is saving me from myself. At a certain point when there are thousands of dollars of livestock in a display the cost of a controller becomes a moot point given the levels of redundancy they give you.
Some things to think about:
- What are your goals with your tank?
- How much are you dosing in 2 part right now? Over time the cost of 2 part adds up fast in a system your size.
- How are you dosing it? Reliable dosing equipment is expensive as well.
- When I was doing 2 part, I had to test alk, calc, and mag frequently vs Calc reactor I test only Alk maybe once every week or two?
With anything new, there is a learning curve. Its not a complicated as you think it is and there is a ton of info out there on them and you have people on here that can help answer questions. It takes about a week or two to get dialed in and depending on growth, you may have to adjust it every other month or so.
Either direction you choose, it will have its pros and cons. For me, I hated weekly testing and sure you can get a trident to do it, but the price point and the upkeep didn't make sense to me. Then you add 2 part, the time to mix them and store them, again, just more time and space. Now it's test Alk every other week, Calc media gets topped off once a year when I tear it down to clean it, 5g co2 tank gets filled ~9 months, and slight tuning every 2-3 months.
Dual stage CO2 regulator and 20# tank
Dual stage CO2 regulator, with solenoid and needle valve and 20# tank. Regulator was built by Alan Le. Tank has some CO2 left $250 Cash or paypal Friends and family. Porch pick up in Lawrenceville
atlantareefclub.org
You don't even need a PH controller. I run one without it. I do it the old school method and measure the effluent and key it here to get to where I need: http://reef.diesyst.com/reactor/reactor.html. I been burned before where the PH probe goes bad and either dumping additional co2 or not enough. Also, even easier/quicker just to get you up and running, you can just get it plumbed and measure your alk in your tank, wait 2 days, measure it again. Adjust your co2 up or down depending on where your alk target. Then do it again. Start off with like 1 bubble per second if you have a bubble counter.
I recommend the pull method (peristaltic dosing pump) rather than the push method (feed pump). But it's up to you, if you use the push method (cheaper), get a dedicated feed pump (small sicce pump works and very reliable). If you go with the pull method, Kamoer FX-STP works great. Pull vs Push is exactly how it sounds. One pulls water through the calc reactor, one pushes water through it.
@york1 is selling an amazing regulator. If that one is too pricey, maybe we can work something out and you buy one I have and I can buy the one from him.
I’ll definitely be interested in that!
Dual stage CO2 regulator and 20# tank
Dual stage CO2 regulator, with solenoid and needle valve and 20# tank. Regulator was built by Alan Le. Tank has some CO2 left $250 Cash or paypal Friends and family. Porch pick up in Lawrenceville
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