My question is why can't our lfs' compete with online prices? I know you might not be able to hang with marine depot or somewhere like that on drygoods but they should be able to come close on fish and corals. The online vendors have the right idea i think by doing both online and having a store front. Maybe that is the direction some of our stores should head in! I support my local stores but it is getting tough. I keep trying though. When you NEED there services it's hard tp put a price on that. Hopefully we will keep them going! The good ones anyways....
LFS going extinct?
- Thread starter seth the wine guy
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At this point, I am mostly buying everything i need today from LFS. I'm basically buying maintenance supplies, i.e., salt, frozen food, CUC, etc. I do find it necessary to order special stuff (BRS two part, ecotech marine replacement parts, etc) online since they are not available locally. I still like to buy livestock locally but really have not added much to my system over the past few years. As for corals, almost all of my new corals have come out of local club members tanks.
The LFS has a much higher cost of business than the online retailer. An online entity simply needs to rent a large, or small, warehouse in an industrial part of town and do business. That warehouse does not need to be clean or temperature controlled, empployee costs are much lower as you do not need as many people to simply pick orders.
Compare thae above to your LFS who has a nice clean emvironment, one that is cooled to 72 degrees and has multiple employees to provide customer service as well as maintain the displays in top notch condition.
I have been to the large scale importer warehouses and they are not even in the same category as our LFS. I have also been to Marine Depot to pick things up and can assure you that it is a long way from the LFS experience. The bottom line is that the LFS is a business and the cost to do business is much higher than it is for an online store.
Online fish and coral prices are not that different, IME, and many times the online prices are higher than what you would pay at a LFS for the same thing. I have bought online before only to receive sick corals, and then if you have an issue you get a credit that you may or may not use, but no reimbursement for the $40 you just spent in shipping cost.
Of all the online coral/fish sellers, LiveAquaria is probably the best, IMO, but their prices reflect that, and they cost more to buy from than LFS in most cases.
Mail order is good for certain LE type pieces, and sometimes you cannot get the fish/coral you want locally. I ordered aiptasia eating filefish online because good luck finding them locally, for example.
This is not a new topic by any means. Mail order livestock and supplies have been available to Aquarists for at least 20 years. My first Discus Fish came delivered to me mail order in 1985. I remember talking to Jorge and Angela (owners of PureReef) in the early 1990s about the threat that mail order posed to LFS, and they are still going strong in the local retail market 19 years or so later.
Like any industry, the quality LFS will shine through and be successful. I doubt the internet will kill the good ones.
What I have seen in the last 20 years locally is the shrinking of the freshwater market down to only a few retailers, and a huge rise in number of saltwater/reef only specialty stores. The big box, national chain pet stores have never been more than a joke with their saltwater selection and maintenance practices. That's what you get when you only pay minimum wage and only hire high school students.
I understand that there is a higher cost of business in a lfs but what i am getting at is, if the money seems to be going to the online vendors why not try and merge the two? I'm not saying it would be easy. I just think the lfs' could probably do some internet sales on top of there normal store sales. And as far as i know it typically works out that the more you sell the cheaper you can buy it and therefore sell it. Not trying to stir the pot, just a thought...
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I spend VERY VERY LITTLE at a LFS if anything.
The reason is geographical. The closest LFS is at LEAST 45 mins from my home and with 2 kids driving round trip 1.5hours isn't always a great idea. Even at that the LFS isn't well, stocked, educated, or employed. I don't even mention high end equipment in there.. they have no IDEA what it is. :/
That being said, and Jenn can attest to the fact, if there WERE a LFS in my area I would def frequent it.
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The reason is geographical. The closest LFS is at LEAST 45 mins from my home and with 2 kids driving round trip 1.5hours isn't always a great idea. Even at that the LFS isn't well, stocked, educated, or employed. I don't even mention high end equipment in there.. they have no IDEA what it is. :/
That being said, and Jenn can attest to the fact, if there WERE a LFS in my area I would def frequent it.
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Good to hear there are some decent chain stores somewhere. I've seen a couple in Atlanta as well, and have known their SW mangers, and frankly, the quality of the SW department was at most times dictated by what the Store owner let them spend.
A good example was the old Petland Duluth. A friend of mine named James was the Fish Manger there for several years, and when he ran the place the FW and SW sections were as nice as anywhere, even though he only had those display tank racks to work with, each tank only having an internal sponge filter. He was a stickler for proper water changes and tank maintenance, etc, so he did a lot with what he had and and sold healthy fish and corals without a centralized filter system. He worked a PureReef until a few months ago when he moved to Florida with his family.
He was a great example of how important and what a difference the right person in the position is.
When I still lived in Atl. all my livestock purchases were from an local LFS. Now that the only retailer that is near me is owned by a dishonest, arrogant, jerk (its a long story...lol) I will not shop there. I now only get livestock from online or through my local club.
I can say from experience, having been a aquatics dept. head @ a big box retailer (it begins with a P) in Alpharetta, the challenges were numerous! We had absolutely no coice but to buy from one distributor(allowed to order 125% of last weeks sales), could not quarentine or isolate a sick fish, couldn't get the systems equiptment fixed if it broke (I had a broken protien skimmer for two yrs and a undersized return pump). I personally thought the products we sold that were geared for SW was garbage.
I started a personal reef tank while working at the store, and can honestly say I didn't buy any equiptment for the tank at the store (even with my discount!)
Now when I visit my family in Atl. I try to stop in to a few shops while in town to see if there's anything I can't live without.
I can say from experience, having been a aquatics dept. head @ a big box retailer (it begins with a P) in Alpharetta, the challenges were numerous! We had absolutely no coice but to buy from one distributor(allowed to order 125% of last weeks sales), could not quarentine or isolate a sick fish, couldn't get the systems equiptment fixed if it broke (I had a broken protien skimmer for two yrs and a undersized return pump). I personally thought the products we sold that were geared for SW was garbage.
I started a personal reef tank while working at the store, and can honestly say I didn't buy any equiptment for the tank at the store (even with my discount!)
Now when I visit my family in Atl. I try to stop in to a few shops while in town to see if there's anything I can't live without.
I really don't see them going away but more of a limited number. I believe the only ones that will exist eventually will be the ones that provide top notch customer service whether your purchasing anything or not, offer the best products at the best prices, top quality livestock and do what it takes even if they take a loss now and then to keep a customer. I know it sounds a bit demanding but with the economy today, people are demanding. That IMO will be the only way to become the success story and survive. BTW, I do know a couple that are on the right track and they get my business, I forget about the rest.
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I buy all the live stocks from LFS (Not just one) and few things that they dont have in stock I just buy it on-line.... I hate asking to special order for me then I have to drive there to pick up... it's easier if I just order on-line... But wehn it comes to some equipment I don't know which is better... I get LFS to order it for me ^^
local LFS for me I just have a problem with paying all those shipping charges and risking losing a piece of life due to shipping issues. Plus looking at a pic taken under extreme lighting plus photo shop makes a coral look much better than it might be. Not to mention there is nothing like the one on one personal relationship with a local person.
I'm still kind of old fashioned in the sense that I like to do business face to face. When it comes to a place to eat or a place to shop. It's nice to go where you have a first name basis relationship. I do and have shopped online for some things, but the LFS is still the goto for me.
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There is just something undeniably comforting about walking into a store and having the owner recognize you. When he can remember your name and asks how your tank/livestock are doing, it sparks conversation and helps build a relationship that you can do without, but just isn't the same when you buy online.
As of yet, I've only ever bought at an LFS, and that might change due to budget constrictions, but money not being an issue, I think I'll remain true to the LFS in my area. The advice and expertise you get from a person that has been successful in maintaining multiple tanks is something that replaces hours of research.
As of yet, I've only ever bought at an LFS, and that might change due to budget constrictions, but money not being an issue, I think I'll remain true to the LFS in my area. The advice and expertise you get from a person that has been successful in maintaining multiple tanks is something that replaces hours of research.
I cant see online doing much harm to a good local store. I drive from Alabama to your area occasionally and spend an entire day going to all your better stores. I perfer to see what I am buying as far as livestock goes and usually make purchases in several places while I am there. I get what I want enjoy the time spent and no waiting on the fed-ex folks. You folks are blessed with an awesome selection of retailers. I have been to rits once or twice at his home and once or twice to his new store and I gaurantee if I walked in this afternoon he would greet me by name. Makes me want to support him.
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