Message to New People to Reefing

[jhutto]

Fellow reefers,
Over the last few months, I have noticed lots of new folks joining the hobby. That is great and we are happy to have those join our club and see them grow in experience levels! All of us started some where in the process. Many of the veterans have asked the new people to read and read to get the basics down. Many books have been recommended like the Conscientious Marine Aquarist and others to help with the basics.

Often I see people wanting to go way too fast by putting critters in tanks before the tank is ready, i.e. not enough live food due to newness of tank, too small of a tank for the larger fish who need large swimming area, or incompatible fish/corals.

Many times new people will ask questions stating they want to add X to their tank and wanting feedback. After feedback is provided, some will challenge the feedback by saying they want to add X anyway. My thoughts are to let the new folks know that there are certain chemistry and biology rules that must be followed.

Its impossible to teach everything to the new folks in this forum. The best advice is always to go slow and enjoy the journey verus rushing things. I have seen too many people come in a rush, do things fast and then get frustrated, loose fish/corals and then really begin to research things and figure it all out.

Others get frustrated complain about the losses in fish and money and then leave the hobby. We all want everyone to experience the hobby and love it for all the beauty it provides for our enjoyment!

Just wanted to reinforce all the feedback that is given often. Go slow, read and read, and then ask the veterans on the site. All of us are willing to help. Please take into consideration that there are several ways to do lots of things. However, when the rules of chemistry and biology are violated the changes for long term success gets smaller. Let learn and enjoy our hobby and the beauty it brings.

Joe

 

[jade76]

jhutto;191891 wrote: Fellow reefers,
Over the last few months, I have noticed lots of new folks joining the hobby. That is great and we are happy to have those join our club and see them grow in experience levels! All of us started some where in the process. Many of the veterans have asked the new people to read and read to get the basics down. Many books have been recommended like the Conscientious Marine Aquarist and others to help with the basics.

Often I see people wanting to go way too fast by putting critters in tanks before the tank is ready, i.e. not enough live food due to newness of tank, too small of a tank for the larger fish who need large swimming area, or incompatible fish/corals.

Many times new people will ask questions stating they want to add X to their tank and wanting feedback. After feedback is provided, some will challenge the feedback by saying they want to add X anyway. My thoughts are to let the new folks know that there are certain chemistry and biology rules that must be followed.

Its impossible to teach everything to the new folks in this forum. The best advice is always to go slow and enjoy the journey verus rushing things. I have seen too many people come in a rush, do things fast and then get frustrated, loose fish/corals and then really begin to research things and figure it all out.

Others get frustrated complain about the losses in fish and money and then leave the hobby. We all want everyone to experience the hobby and love it for all the beauty it provides for our enjoyment!

Just wanted to reinforce all the feedback that is given often. Go slow, read and read, and then ask the veterans on the site. All of us are willing to help. Please take into consideration that there are several ways to do lots of things. However, when the rules of chemistry and biology are violated the changes for long term success gets smaller. Let learn and enjoy our hobby and the beauty it brings.

Joe

B-I-N-G-O!!!!

 

[chemically_balanced]

So I've done my research and I think I'm ready to drop that Black-tip Shark in my 55 gallon. I have a 30 gallon rubber-maid tote full of bio balls. I also just dropped 10 pounds of LR and two 10 pound bags of LS in the tank. I'm running 5 returns off the mag3 pump because I know my shark need flow.

Like I said I've done my research. Any of you vents care to challenge my decision?

 

[basscyn]

The Conscientious Marine Aquarist.

Is this the quintessential guide for rookies? I must admit, most of my learning has come from internet surfing and reading these forums.

But if I was to get <u>one</u> book, is this the one to seek out? I have heard this one recomended before.

Is it current?

Thanks!

 

[xyzpdq0121]

BASSCYN;191966 wrote: The Conscientious Marine Aquarist.

Is this the quintessential guide for rookies? I must admit, most of my learning has come from internet surfing and reading these forums.

But if I was to get <u>one</u> book, is this the one to seek out? I have heard this one recomended before.

Is it current?

Thanks!

Ya, I would say so.. It is the most current considering that they just put out a new edition earlier this month (so look for the

 

[flyingarmy]

Chemically_Balanced;191954 wrote: So I've done my research and I think I'm ready to drop that Black-tip Shark in my 55 gallon. I have a 30 gallon rubber-maid tote full of bio balls. I also just dropped 10 pounds of LR and two 10 pound bags of LS in the tank. I'm running 5 returns off the mag3 pump because I know my shark need flow.

Like I said I've done my research. Any of you vents care to challenge my decision?

First I would say that you are incorrect in a few of your decisions:

1) You will need 2 Black-tips so you can have a mated pair(even though they haven't bred you can call them mated)

2) A 55GAL is way too big, go with a 30Cube and a 240GAL Sump.

3) I would double up on the Bio-balls and make sure you never clean them.

4) The LR amount seems about right, I hope that you used uncured LR since it will nuke your system quicker!

5) I would at least go up to a MAG9.5 since they can give you over 2400GPH at 40ft head pressure.

Hope these answers help you in your reefing endevours.

 

[simon_kruger]

Im following "Chemically_Balanced" build thread and I really dont think you need to a skimmer either. The 100watt desk lamp as a light looks cool and gives the tank a nice yellow shimmer. Good luck with that.

All joking asside. I think jhutto's points are all valid and needs to said from time to time. Well done.

 

[skriz]

Chemically_Balanced;191954 wrote: So I've done my research and I think I'm ready to drop that Black-tip Shark in my 55 gallon. I have a 30 gallon rubber-maid tote full of bio balls. I also just dropped 10 pounds of LR and two 10 pound bags of LS in the tank. I'm running 5 returns off the mag3 pump because I know my shark need flow.

Like I said I've done my research. Any of you vents care to challenge my decision?

PLEASE tell me that you have a HOB biowheel on your tank with that kind of bioload?

 

[george]

BASSCYN;191966 wrote: The Conscientious Marine Aquarist.

Is this the quintessential guide for rookies? I must admit, most of my learning has come from internet surfing and reading these forums.

But if I was to get <u>one</u> book, is this the one to seek out? I have heard this one recomended before.

Is it current?

Thanks!

I would agree with this, but I would also strongly recomend

 

[drnecropolis]

No need for a biowheel setup. Go the advance route... under gravel filter. Top notch for 2 or 3 sharks

 

[jhutto]

Some of you guys make us laugh and that is good for all!

JH

 

[jefft]

Forget the sharks, I would go with a Sun fish!

 

[ralph atl]

best thread vote!

 

[chemically_balanced]

I'm glad everyone got that was a joke and I hope some people got a good laugh...

 

[sailfish]

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Rambling from an SPS addict. The following are ramblings and the experience of a fellow hobbyist. I am not a scientist, biologist nor do I pretend to be. I know enough to know I am always learning. Most of the time I am able to keep sps alive and colorful. As is written on G. Carroll signature </span></span><span style="color: red;"><span style="font-family: Verdana;">Be wary of advice coming from those who will not show you the fruits of their success!</span></span><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">I will post links to some of my threads with photos. There are many ways to keep a successful sps tank so find what works for you. I am sure I left something out or got something wrong so please share your experience and knowledge.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">So you want to keep SPS. In my experience once you start you can’t go back. So if you want to have more time on your hands then stick with the softies and LPS.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">All you have to do is keep things stable. You need light levels above 300 </span>PAR(IMHO between 400-800 is ideal which means Meatal Halide or High Output T-5 with individual reflectors)<span style="font-size: 13px;"> while keeping your temperature between 82 and 77. You need a way to keep your Calcium , Magnesium, Alkalinity, PH, & Salinity in the proper range. </span>(For proper ranges see table A1. below)<span style="font-size: 13px;">This is best achieved by dosing daily not once a week. These are all interrelated so if one is out of wack the others will be also. You need to keep Nitrates low if not 0 and phosphates at or below .03 tested with a good test </span>(Hanna meter, merck etc..)<span style="font-size: 13px;">. </span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">If I could only test one thing in my tank it would be Alkalinity. I use </span>(Lamotte for accuracy and check it against an API one I use to save money.)<span style="font-size: 13px;"> I test once a week at minimum but sometimes more.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Next Magnesium then Calcium and last Phosphates. I do not test for Nitrates but you should if you tank is new or are having any issues. I test maybe once a month for Phosphates because I have learned what mine usually is and were problems may arise from. Some Phosphate removers can have negative affects on your sps. </span>(burnt tips & STN)<span style="font-size: 13px;">Be careful, start slow and follow the directions.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Don’t dose anything if you are not testing for it. I have done it and still do on occasion but do as I say not as I do.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Be careful when dosing magnesium. Add it slowly and over a few days. Read on using homemade recipes they are not balanced</span>.(Epson salt)<span style="font-size: 13px;"> Been burned here</em>.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Are better tests kits really worth the money? IMHO yes. I have been burned here before</em>.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">When a parameter is testing off test again and if possible test with a different test before taking action. I have been burned here before</em>.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Don’t chase numbers around. I think each tank has an equilibrium and if your calcium is a little low but in the acceptable range let it be.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Testing and dosing your tank is not as hard as one can make it out to be. Just test often and go slow. I find it usually takes a lot more then what I think it will to make what ever changes I am trying to make.(</span>Us a chemistry calculator for guidance but start out with less then they suggest to be safe they are not always correct. There is a link to one below but use at your own risk)</span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">IMO if your not going to test and dose then don’t get sps. If you do and you have a problem why even post what’s wrong with my sps because it’s probably one or all of the factors mentioned above. I work hard to keep everything were it needs to be and still end up with problems.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Water changes can do wonders. I think one of my keys to success is regular water changes. I change at least 10% a week. IMHO water changes are not enough to compensate for dosing Calcium and Alkalinity.</span>(unless it’s a small tank) <span style="font-size: 13px;">This rumor was a big disservice to me in the beginning. Most salt mixes do not meet acceptable ranges so changing water will not necessarily get you were you need to go. You would also have to change large amounts of water to affect the parameter you are wanting to change.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">You need to test each new bucket of salt to see how it matches up to your tank and adjust accordingly. Been burned several times</em>.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">I think it goes without saying water quality is just as important as light. I believe in over skimming.</span></span>


<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">I think the most dangerous thing to do with a healthy SPS tank is introducing more corals. Dip all corals and if possible quarantine them. I have a small bucket, air stone and heater I use to dip corals. They receive an interceptor treatment for 8hrs and then a dip in Tropic Marine coral cure. All this and you can still end up catching something. The only sure way is to quarantine them for a least a month with multiple dips. I use a cheap magnifying glass with a light to inspect the corals</span>(buy at any office supply store)<span style="font-size: 13px;">.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">IMHO people leave this hobby for a reason and if you buy their coral and don’t follow very careful procedures you may get that reason</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Water flow is a must. You need as much flow as you can afford but not direct flow</span>.(40 X tank volume is a good start<span style="font-size: 13px;">) I think it would be hard for one to have two much indirect flow.</span></span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">There is a big difference between a Maxjet and a Tunze in the type of flow they produce.</span></span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Today there are a lot of cheaper options out there Koralia, Tunze Nano, maxjet mods.</span></span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">I tried them all and they all have there draw backs and benefits. I say get the best you can afford. Quality and customer support is important in this hobby because everything breaks. I have a Tunze 6101, a Tunze Nano 6045, Koralia # 1 under my rock work, Vortech</span>(on ½ to 3/4power)<span style="font-size: 13px;">, an Oceanrunner 3500 return pump on SCWD, and a chiller pushing about 400gph all on a 75 gallion.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Let there be light. I started out with power compacts then went to 150 watt metal halide and worked my way up to 400s. I love the big hot 400s but had very <u>comparable</u> color with 250 watt 10,000k and supplemental actinic. This is a very controversial subject like most things in this hobby so go with what works for you. I feel the more light the better. My experience has led me to shoot for nothing less then 400 PAR for my sps. I have over 65 different sps and only one of them is what I consider to be a low light coral</span>(IMHO less then 450 PAR)<span style="font-size: 13px;">. If I could have 650 for all my coral I would. A more reasonable number seems to be in the 500s. Can you have colorful coral with less light? Sure my experience has shown me that it is easer to keep great color with higher light. I also have seen some corals actually change color under different color spectrums. </span>(That’s right I said change not just appear different.)<span style="font-size: 13px;">I had a coral I got for LFS under 20k that was bright green and turned bright yellow under 10,000k and now is bright greenish yellow under 20,000k. </span></span>


<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Not all corals were created equal. Some corals color up and other don’t. Duh If you buy a brown coral and it stays brown then it could be the coral. I have been known to buy on potential but if I had it all to do over again I would save my money and only by really nice corals. </em>I don’t mean names I mean if you buy corals from a good place you should expect that is the best they will ever look. </span>(This way you won’t be let down especially buying online)</em><span style="font-size: 13px;"> You may pay more but IMHO it’s worth it. Some people love buying brown outs and that’s great for them. That’s what’s great about this hobby there is something for everyone. </span></span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Just because you were able to keep LPS and softies does not mean you will be successful with SPS. It takes a lot of dedication, patience, and perseverance to have a beautiful SPS tank.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">This hobby mainly consist of maintenance so if you are not willing or do not have the time to do all it requires save you money and keep softies. Softies and LPS are just if not more beautiful. Love those Acans.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Can you have sps and not fallow these suggestions? Yes.</em> I had a frag that lived for a 9 months under power compacts, maxjet power heads, and hang on skimmer.</em> Would I do it again. NO! </em>Did it look good? OK</em>! Did it grow? Yes but very little in comparison</em>.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">This is all just my experience so </span><span style="color: red;">follow at your own risk</span><span style="font-size: 13px;"> and </span><span style="color: red;">do what works for you</span><span style="font-size: 13px;">. </span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;">Forgive the spelling and grammar if spell check does not catch it then it stays</em><span style="font-size: 13px;">.</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Best equipment That I would buy again:</span></span>
<span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;">1.Flow=Tunze 6101& Vortech</span></span>
<span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;">2.Geo 612 Calcium Reactor</span></span>
<span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;">3. Euro Reef rs 135</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Things I wish I would have bought sooner:</span></span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">1.</span> <span style="font-size: 13px;">Oceanrunner 3500 pump</span></span>
<ul>
<li><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Dwyer Air meter for skimmer</span></span></li>
<li><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">400 watt 20,000k</span></span></li>
</ul><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">4. Custom made shallow reef tank</span></span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Things I would not buy again:</span></span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">1.aqua medic two part dose </span>(The unit itself is ok but the two part idea has led me to have great fluctions because I can’t visually inspect it like I can a calcium reactor)</em></span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;">2. Euro Reef rs180</span>
<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;">3. Pacfic Cost Import CL 280 1/10 chiller</span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">A1. Water Parameters and other helpful links these are not my sites use at your own risk </span></span>
http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-05/rhf/index.php"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.reefkeeping.com/issues/2004-05/rhf/index.php</span></span></span></a>

[IMG]http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chemcalc.html"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://home.comcast.net/~jdieck1/chemcalc.html</span></span></span></a>

[IMG]http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=102605"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://archive.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=102605</span></span></span></a>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Other helpful links:</span></span>

[IMG]http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2008/6/"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2008/6/</span></span></span></a>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Acro Pests</span></span>

[IMG]http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=756327&perpage=25&pagenumber=1"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=756327&perpage=25&pagenumber=1</span></span></span></a>

[IMG]http://www.melevsreef.com/aefw.html"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.melevsreef.com/aefw.html</span></span></span></a>

[IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=4223&highlight=red+bugs"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=4223&highlight=red+bugs</span></span></span></a>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">My threads with some photos</span></span>

[IMG]http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1403690"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?threadid=1403690</span></span></span></a>

[IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=16536"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=16536</span></span></span></a>

[IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=16223"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=16223</span></span></span></a>

[IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=14176"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=14176</span></span></span></a>

[IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10021"><span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;"><span style="color: #800080;">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=10021</span></span></span></a>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">Some of my past troubles with sps</span></span>

<span style="font-family: Times New Roman;"><span style="font-size: 13px;">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=8469</span></span>

 

[basscyn]

WOW!
Thats a <u>lot</u> for .2