Nubie needs help with new tank

[atcaw94]

I've had my tank up for a little over a month. It cycled, so I put a CUC in a couple of weeks ago. Added a Eibli Angel a week or so ago. The problem is I can't get the Nitrates down. I think it's killing off some of my CUC and I'm afraid my Acan frag is done, it doesn't open up at night anymore. I did a partial water change and cleaned the filter a couple of days ago, but the nitrates are still around 20 (as far as I can tell, I'm old and it's hard to tell what color the friggin test water is:unsure

55 gallon tank
0 ammonia
0 nitrite
20 nitrate
1.025 salinity

Any suggestions, I thought a water change would bring the nitrates down. Is the tank just not done cycling?

 

[notireef]

What type of filtration do you have? How much Live rock? What test are you using?

 

[atcaw94]

NotiReef;372490 wrote: What type of filtration do you have? How much Live rock? What test are you using?

In tank Juwel filter
Only about 5-10 lbs of live rock, 30 lbs of base rock
I have an API and a Saltwater Master liquid test kit by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals.

 

[wbrown]

Some hermits that are generally part of a CUC munch on coral polyps. try moving the hermits to a sump or QT tank for a week or three and see if the acan makes a rebound.
Nitrate in the 20's is not fatal, and can easily be lowered by using macro algae such as cheato. You can create a cheato fuge out of a strawberry basket and an old set of the missus' nylons to contain the strands of algae and keep them from taking over the display.

 

[notireef]

IMO you need more LR. Filter could be the issue. They are nitrate factories. I would get a decent skimmer and toss the filter.
How much do you feed? That might be adding to the problem.
Try some macro algae like cheato. That should help and also lots of water changes to bring it down.

 

[wbrown]

atcaw94;372495 wrote: In tank Juwel filter
Only about 5-10 lbs of live rock, 30 lbs of base rock
I have an API and a Saltwater Master liquid test kit by Aquarium Pharmaceuticals.

I would encourage you to upgrade your test kit. Seachem makes a fine kit, and if that's too expensive, the Tetra kits are at least a magnitude better than the API kits.

 

[atcaw94]

Here's the filter I have
http://www.juwel-aquarium.de/en/aktuelle_modelle303.htm?cat=77">http://www.juwel-aquarium.de/en/aktuelle_modelle303.htm?cat=77</a>

I have some cheato in the filter box. I know I need more live rock.
I have not seen the hermits munch on the acan, the angelfish did the first day it was in the tank, but he nipped at everything. I only feed once a day.

 

[notireef]

Also the angel might be nipping at the acan....maybe thats why it's closed up.

 

[jennm]

Welcome to ARC

I'd put the Eibli angel on the prime suspect list for the distress of the coral. While some of the Centropyge species of angels are somewhat "reef safe" (with exceptions) - this one is not.

Nitrates at 20 aren't fatal as a rule, but for a tank that's only 1 month old... that's unusually high. Nitrates tend to climb over long periods of time, if unchecked, or if water change volume and/or frequency isn't keeping up with the load.

I would have the result checked against another test kit, just to be sure you're getting a correct result - and if it is correct, then some water changing may need to be done - small amounts, but more frequently tends to be less stressful and more successful than doing a large water change all at once.

If you plan to add more live rock (recommended), please be sure the rock is well cured before adding it to your display that already has livestock in it. Fully cured rock can be added without any significant concern, but if there's any die-off remaining on it, that can cause an ammonia spike and the tank to cycle again - and ammonia and nitrite are very harmful to your inhabitants.

Hope this helps

Jenn

 

[atcaw94]

JennM;372515 wrote: Welcome to ARC

I'd put the Eibli angel on the prime suspect list for the distress of the coral. While some of the Centropyge species of angels are somewhat "reef safe" (with exceptions) - this one is not.

Nitrates at 20 aren't fatal as a rule, but for a tank that's only 1 month old... that's unusually high. Nitrates tend to climb over long periods of time, if unchecked, or if water change volume and/or frequency isn't keeping up with the load.

I would have the result checked against another test kit, just to be sure you're getting a correct result - and if it is correct, then some water changing may need to be done - small amounts, but more frequently tends to be less stressful and more successful than doing a large water change all at once.

If you plan to add more live rock (recommended), please be sure the rock is well cured before adding it to your display that already has livestock in it. Fully cured rock can be added without any significant concern, but if there's any die-off remaining on it, that can cause an ammonia spike and the tank to cycle again - and ammonia and nitrite are very harmful to your inhabitants.

Hope this helps

Jenn

So I guess I should get rid of the Eibli?
I'm getting more live rock tomorrow from an established tank.

 

[jennm]

That would be my recommendation if you plan to keep more corals. IF he's not nibbling the Acan, chances are you'll get something at some point that he will nibble. Individuals may vary, but in general most don't consider the Eibli "reef safe". The occasional individual may behave - but that specie is more likely than not, to eat coral.

Jenn

 

[atcaw94]

JennM;372533 wrote: That would be my recommendation if you plan to keep more corals. IF he's not nibbling the Acan, chances are you'll get something at some point that he will nibble. Individuals may vary, but in general most don't consider the Eibli "reef safe". The occasional individual may behave - but that specie is more likely than not, to eat coral.

Jenn

What and how many fish would you recommend for a 55 gal tank? I'm bummed about the Eibli, he's a fun fish. He's active and swims in and out of all the crevices I have in my rock.

 

[jennm]

Short answer: depends. Depends on the needs of the fish. Usually one "showy" fish like a dwarf angel, and several smaller fish.

Back when I had my 55, I had a Coral Beauty, pair of Tomato Clowns, pair of Engineer Gobies and a 6-lined wrasse. That was about my limit. The Angel was the "king" but if you asked the clowns, they'd have told you they ruled Today I'd probably go for some skunk clowns or something a bit less aggressive (and everybody has ocellaris LOL including me now!)... the engineers were interesting - very shy and in my case they didn't put sand on everything but they did stick in their burrow except to eat, and the 6-line was a busy little dude and he didn't bother anybody (some 6 lines can be bullies).

Substitute what suits you - but 6 or so in a 55 is usually a comfortable number as long as there aren't territory conflicts etc.

Jenn

 

[atcaw94]

JennM;372571 wrote: Short answer: depends. Depends on the needs of the fish. Usually one "showy" fish like a dwarf angel, and several smaller fish.

Back when I had my 55, I had a Coral Beauty, pair of Tomato Clowns, pair of Engineer Gobies and a 6-lined wrasse. That was about my limit. The Angel was the "king" but if you asked the clowns, they'd have told you they ruled Today I'd probably go for some skunk clowns or something a bit less aggressive (and everybody has ocellaris LOL including me now!)... the engineers were interesting - very shy and in my case they didn't put sand on everything but they did stick in their burrow except to eat, and the 6-line was a busy little dude and he didn't bother anybody (some 6 lines can be bullies).

Substitute what suits you - but 6 or so in a 55 is usually a comfortable number as long as there aren't territory conflicts etc.

Jenn

Excuse me in advance, if some of these questions seem dumb,I'm new to this hobby:confused2:
But, isn't a Eibli and a coral beauty both dwarf angels? Is the Coral Beauty less likey to nip coral than the Eibli? I planned on a couple of ocellaris and a wrasse eventually. But I started with the Angel cause it's "showy"

 

[jennm]

The only "dumb" question is the one not asked - so no worries there - we're all here to help each other.

YES - they are both of the genus Centropyge. Both dwarf angels. Some are more likely than others to nip at corals and ALL are likely to nip at clams. In general, Flame Angels and Coral Beauties (and a few others) are considered "safe" - with caution. Some can be model citizens, and others aren't. Some develop a taste for a certain kind of coral but leave the rest alone. In my case, my Coral Beauty ate Xenia (which some people may see as a good thing!) I just quit trying to keep Xenia and it left everything else alone.

A client of mine had a Flame Angel that had an appetite for Trachyphyllia and Wellsophyllia (open brain) - left everything else alone.

Some will mow down anything and everything, and some won't bother anything - just depends on the individual.

In general, it's my experience that Eibli, Lemonpeel, for example - are all too risky - they are more likely to nip and as such, not good reef tank choices. I'm sure there is somebody out there who has kept one that was no problem - but the majority are.

With Centropyge angels, one sort of "plays the odds". Odds aren't good for the Eibli, IMO.

For what it's worth - I like the Eibli too for its looks. Very pretty fish.

Jenn

 

[atcaw94]

What do you think is killing off my CUC? I started with 6 hermits, 5 Nassarius and 7 Astria. I think I'm down to 2 of each.

 

[jennm]

Hrmm... well sometimes hermits kill snails to eat them. It's odd for hermits to just die - those things are pretty bulletproof. Are you sure they are dying, or just molting?

Jenn

 

[kevheng]

i had a problem with the cuc dying off too. but no one could tell me what was going on. i had a high nitrate level in my tank ranging form 40 to 80 ppm. that could have killed off most of the cuc. but if any one else has any idea on what is going on i am all ears as well.

but now my cuc is fine and my nitrate level is down too.

 

[jennm]

Well high nitrates can cause some to die off, that's for sure. How were they acclimated? Inverts are sensitive to pH and specific gravity changes, so that could be at work too.

Jenn

 

[kevheng]

i think that is what happend with my cuc in the 20 gallon i had. when i started out i didn't treat my water before each water change. maybe that had something to do with it. because now i prefilter the water and use pH buffer, but i am still young in the hobby as well. i just try to read as much as possible and listen to all the help from ARC.

p.s. thanks jenn for all the help and advice so far and to come.