Return Line Placement...

[texhorns98]

I need to decide on my return line placement today so I can get this build under way. The overflow will be tucked in the back left corner in a 45 degree angle box. I can run the return back up through that (meaning a slightly large box) OR I can come up through the back of the tank and place it anywhere I'd like. Right now the return section of the sump is on the right, but that won't really matter in the long run. I can also choose to split the return into two if I want, but I'm only running 700 or so gph. Anyone have thoughts? Total tank dimensions are 48x21x25.

 

[texhorns98]

ECHO...ECHo...ECho...Echo...

 

[chymos45]

One of the few regrets on my new 185 is having a full height overflow box (4 bulkheads in the bottom). If your tank/overflow isn't built yet, or not yet drilled, you may want to give some consideration to an overflow box that is only as deep as necessary to get a bulkhead through the back glass. This will give you a little more "floor space" in the tank.

 

[texhorns98]

Chymos,

I'm confused as to what you mean. Right now, I have two drains in the left corner (floor). I can keep that overflow box smaller if I run my return line through the back glass up high. Nothing is done yet, but it needs to be decided soon so Chris can place the glass order.

 

[chymos45]

Not exactly. In order for what I am poorly trying to explain to work, the bulkheads would need to go through the high glass only, NOT the floor.
The water would flow over the teeth and into a shallow box. This box would contain a drain pipe of some sort (Durso, Gurgle buster, etc.). Once the water enters this drain, it would take an immediate 90 through the back glass of the tank instead of draining all the way to the bottom of the tank and through the floor mounted bulkheads. The depth of the box would be determined on how quickly you could make the 90.
Think of it very much like a HOB overflow box, but permanently mounted inside the tank, not requiring a siphon. Only difference is the bulkheads are in the back fothe box, not the bottom.
Clear as mud?

 

[weaglereefer]

Well if you're gonna do that might as well make it an external overflow or do a Calfo style and get the most out of it.

 

[chymos45]

au01st;343768 wrote: might as well make it an external overflow

Agreed. I just didn't know where Tex was in the process. I will be designing my next home, it <u>will</u> include a fish room, and the built in tank will definately have an external overflow into that room.

 

[texhorns98]

"Clear as mud?" Like Baccarat!

I'm not sure I want to plumb everything through the back of the tank right now. Two drains in this box will make for a very small footprint, really.

 

[chymos45]

Small footprint, but be sure to allow enough room in the box to give yourself a fighting chance of catching a butthead bluespot goby that decided to jump the wall. Seriously, I even have a custom acrylic cap on my overflow, and the little bugger fit between the teeth! Yes, I'm irritated.

 

[texhorns98]

Why not pull the durso and let him fall into the sump then? If I go with a return of the back glass, would you think one or two lines? So many choices! I like the idea of having everything on one side of the tank (clean look)...then again, it would be nice to have my vortech on the left and my return on the right. I think I think too much...

 

[chymos45]

He's been in there a week, and I'm giving him another week to decide if he wants to jump back or not (not likely) until I do exactly that. What a ride!

As for the return location, since you have a vortech, my vote is a single return line that shares the overflow box on the left. With the Vortech on the right, you will be getting MUCH more flow right to left, moving the crud towards</em> the overflow, rather than away from it. This is the same setup I had on my old 90 FOWLR.

 

[texhorns98]

I appreciate that thought, Chymos. However, (of course THAT was coming!) I have my Vortech on the left due to the noise when it gets going. My wife's head is about 3 feet from the tank wall when we watch TV and if she ain't happy, NOBODY is! I have it placed just above the halfway mark of the tank. It actually does well there because of the undertow effect. Even though the pump is on the left, all the softies on the floor move from right to left! The only reason I was contemplating moving the return was to cut down on the size of the overflow box, really.

Edit: I should also mention that Chris (Fish Scales) has a cool idea about pulling water from multiple parts of the water column. I think this is done on some mass produced tanks, but I've never seen it on a custom or DIY job.

 

[texhorns98]

bratliff;343804 wrote: Unless this is a fish only tank, I think you'll want two vortechs, one on each side pointed at each other, to provide flow. I have mine mounted this way (also a four foot tank) up high about 4 inches below the water line and the flow throughout the tank is awesome. The fish even really seem to enjoy it so, even in a FOWLR I'd go with two vortechs on a 4 foot or longer tank.

I have two Tunzes in their as well. At peak I'm easily running 30X flow in the tank. Another Vortech would be cool, but see the above post about the noise!:mad2:&lt;---My wife when the tank is too noisy!

 

[texhorns98]

You got it Brett! Actually, they're not that loud until they start getting cranked up (at the top of reefcrest mode). Now I'm actually thinking about a calflo style. Nothing's been done yet, we're just trying to go ahead and get glass ordered. What do you guys think about frosting the back glass (from the outside, obviously)?

 

[texhorns98]

bratliff;343830 wrote: If you were planning on lighting the back of the tank, then the frosted glass might be cool. http://reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=1396078&perpage=25&pagenumber=3">This guy</a> put a light box behind his tank and it's kind of a cool affect (scroll towards the bottom of that page). If you weren't planning on doing something like that, I'd say no to the frosted. Just paint it.[/QUOTE]


Dude, showing me that is like offering a beer to an alcoholic! You can't give me ideas like that, or I'll NEVER get this thing built! :lol2:

 

[fish scales2]

External overflow (18x3.5x9) Three returns (2 at the top left and Right and one center 10" from bottom) I recomended a squid for the 2 returns with Y'd 3/4 locline at the top to alternate current and true union w/ check valve for the bottom that will also be Y'd locline to move water behind the rock. The idea of frosted glass was so that you do not see the plumbing behind the tank. Originaly my idea for overflows to mask the plumbing there.

You guys thoughts, your imput is greatly appreciated.


Chris

 

[texhorns98]

Appreciate the thoughts, Brett. My return pump is only about 700gph, so we're not really talking about a lot of flow, volume wise. What we're talking about is more the placement of the flow. The idea behind the return near the bottom is to allow linear flow along the back of the tank and therefore eliminate (or reduce) the chance for detritus and "junk" build up. You are right on the money, however, when you speak about lower flow throgh the fuge. It's a point of argument for many, but I tend to agree with your opinion.

I too, am a bit concerned by the lower return causing an issue in a power loss. Chris has me convinced that using TWO <u>high quality</u> check valves will help me sleep at night!

Overall, I think we've come up with something not many people will have seen. I like the ideas we've come up with so far, and I like the fact that Chris has been so forward thinking in his approach to my build.

 

[texhorns98]

Once again, I appreciate the thoughts. Hopefully, Chris is still following along here, as well. One thing I failed to mention was that the two upper returns will be on a SCWD. So now we're only talking about two different paths, with two hoses each at any given time.

 

[chymos45]

If you haven't used one already, I have to say I love the SCWD device. I currently have one on my return line and it does a fantastic job. No leaks, virtually silent operation, and provides great random flow, not to mention it uses no power!
It has been very tempting to take it apart to see how it works, as it is MUCH more reliable that those Powersweep pieces of junk that seem to operate by a similar flow-driven mechanism.

 

[fish scales2]

I do believe a closed loop system is a great way to go and we have talked about a good bit. This tank, the way that it is being drilled will acomadate a closed loop system if Trey ever decides to sell it. Currently there is not enough room in the stand for an additional external pump. My goal is to achieve good disruption to flow patterns that the vortech and Tunze will be creating by use of the SCWD. I am not that big on check valves so I am opting for 2, one just before the bottom reurn and one just after the manifold.