Sad Day,Acillies died :(

[jason sartain]

Well after about 2 weeks of nursing our Acillies Tang because of the Ich he had,(http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/search.php?searchid=622890#">[IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/images/misc/paperclip.gif" alt="" /></a> [IMG]http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=22725">Help, Tang is blind? I think...</a>) we got up this morning to find him dead :(
Yesterday he was acting really stressed,he hadn't eaten in about 3 day's,and he had gotten covered in Ich again even though we had been treating for it.
He never recovered from his blindness and I asume he couldn't find his food in the tank and just wasted away.
These are some of the most beautiful fish in the hobby and I really hated too lose him.
Thank's for your addvice in this time of trouble,and I won't be trying another Acillies again because they are so prone to get sick in our tank's.
Maybe they should be left alone in the wild?
What is the mortality rate of these fish in captivity?

 

[bobz]

Bummer dude. I do not have any experience with this species but I feel for you man.
Bob

 

[notireef]

That Sucks!! Sorry to hear that.

 

[jmaneyapanda]

The thing I think most people overlook is that they require IMMENSE water flow and oxygenation. No matter how disease free and properly you feed (and by you, I dont mean YOU, but aquarists in general), they will not thrive without this.

 

[james s_]

Bummer

 

[chauwall]

I had an Achilles once a long time ago that had a similar fate with ich. Upon talking with a LFS, I learned that in order to keep an Achilles, you'll have to run a fish only copper system. Ich will bring them down quick. Sorry for your loss.

 

[fish scales2]

jmaneyapanda;263703 wrote: The thing I think most people overlook is that they require IMMENSE water flow and oxygenation. No matter how disease free and properly you feed (and by you, I dont mean YOU, but aquarists in general), they will not thrive without this.

In a 6' 240g (size of Jasons tank) how much flow would think would sufice?

 

[jmaneyapanda]

Fish Scales2;263718 wrote: In a 6' 240g (size of Jasons tank) how much flow would think would sufice?

In my opinion, you CANNOT have too much flow for fish like achilles, sohals, gutattus, or clown tangs. These fish are from the eref crest area of the reef, where the waves are crashing and water is churning. I couldnt say a number, but it should be immense if you want these animals to thrive. To take a stab, at least 10,000 GPH in a tank taht size, if it were me. And I would be leaning towards double that. JMO.

 

[jmaneyapanda]

dawgdude;263730 wrote: Jeremy what corals are found in that high of flow rates?

A LOT of acro corals are found in that type of enviroment. You know all those pics of exposed reefs at low tide? The other 22 hours fo the day, they are under MASSIVE surge. Any of the thicker "fingered" acros (A. humilis, A. gemmifera), tabling acros often also.

 

[jmaneyapanda]

dawgdude;263740 wrote: I figured, I just have blown the flesh clean off an acro before.....so I am thinking it was not an ultra high flow variety.

Their is a BIG digfference between flow and velocity. 200 GPH in a narrow jet will kill any acro, but 2000 GPH or wide flow will be ideal. Thats why tunze, vortecs, etc are so chic. Wide gentle flow, not a lot of velocity.

 

[jason sartain]

Well I don't have 10-20,000 GPH movement(I'm guessing none of us do) so like I said before,I will not be getting another Acillie's.
I thought I had enough flow for this fish(1600 GPH return pump,2nd 1200 GPH return pump,and around 5100 GPH in powerheads alone)
I can't add anymore flow in my tank because my hammer's,torch's,and other LPS's won't open up.
SPS's love it I guess?

jmaneyapanda;263722 wrote: In my opinion, you CANNOT have too much flow for fish like achilles, sohals, gutattus, or clown tangs. These fish are from the eref crest area of the reef, where the waves are crashing and water is churning. I couldnt say a number, but it should be immense if you want these animals to thrive. To take a stab, at least 10,000 GPH in a tank taht size, if it were me. And I would be leaning towards double that. JMO.

 

[jmaneyapanda]

jason sartain;263760 wrote: Well I don't have 10-20,000 GPH movement(I'm guessing none of us do) so like I said before,I will not be getting another Acillie's.
I thought I had enough flow for this fish(1600 GPH return pump,2nd 1200 GPH return pump,and around 5100 GPH in powerheads alone)
I can't add anymore flow in my tank because my hammer's,torch's,and other LPS's won't open up.
SPS's love it I guess?

My number were just pulled out of the air, so dont take them as absolute baselines. For a tank your size, that is a fair assessment, though. FWIW, in my 210, I have likely 16,000 + GPH running through it. SPS and fish mostly, but it can be done, and needs to at times. That is just my opinion. LPS cannot tolerate the flows that SPS can, as a generalization. Overall, achilles do VERY POORLY ain the majority of aquarist tanks. I think, as my opinion, that the setup has a lot to do with it.

I apologize if you have taken my post as a criticism or lecture. It wasnt intended to be at all. I just was hoping to express my opinion in how to care for these fish.

 

[jason sartain]

No problem,I didn't take it that way at all,I'm glad to have folk's like you that will tell it like it is sometimes.
How did you get so much flow?
I thought I had too much!?!

jmaneyapanda;263762 wrote: My number were just pulled out of the air, so dont take them as absolute baselines. For a tank your size, that is a fair assessment, though. FWIW, in my 210, I have likely 16,000 + GPH running through it. SPS and fish mostly, but it can be done, and needs to at times. That is just my opinion. LPS cannot tolerate the flows that SPS can, as a generalization. Overall, achilles do VERY POORLY ain the majority of aquarist tanks. I think, as my opinion, that the setup has a lot to do with it.

I apologize if you have taken my post as a criticism or lecture. It wasnt intended to be at all. I just was hoping to express my opinion in how to care for these fish.

 

[spike]

Sorry to hear.

 

[jmaneyapanda]

jason sartain;263769 wrote: No problem,I didn't take it that way at all,I'm glad to have folk's like you that will tell it like it is sometimes.
How did you get so much flow?
I thought I had too much!?!

4 tunzes, plus the return pump. If I had LPS, I wouldnt/couldnt do that, but I dont, so I can. See my above comment re: flow vs. velocity, and the ebenfit of those darned pricey tunzes and vortecs. hey are worth their weight in gold.

 

[jason sartain]

Thanks man.I my have to look into getting some of those.

 

[twocute2b4u]

Jason - I am so sorry to hear about your loss!

 

[stacy22]

RIP Clem.

 

[derek_s]

Sorry to hear that as well.

I will say that I have had an achilles for coming up on a year now, and consider him in excellent health. I think running a big 57w UV an feeding heavily (and adding garlic as well as omegas) has helped him a lot, and since I have a rather large skimmer, in addition to 2 vortecs, I'm thinking the O2 exchange must be acceptable, but I have no numbers.

So, if you really want one dont give up. Just be ready to cater to his needs.

 

[ldybkr]

I know how you feel, I felt the same way when I had a two sargassm triggers die. It hurt.:sad: