Switch for Apex Break Out Box

[shafiq_hossain]

<p style="text-align:left;">Anyone hook up a push button switch to an Apex Break Out Box? I know we can hook up a floor wet sensor, door alarm sensors float switches. But I'm looking for a type of switch is designed similar to the floor wet sensor,door alarm sensor or a float switch where it presents a CLOSED or OPEN state.

 

[realfish]

I believe the unofficial guide says you can hook up a door bell switch. Yes, pg 90

 

[rdnelson]

If it accepts a door bell switch it will accept any switch. Think of a switch as connecting 2 wires together. It is just a matter of what causes the wires to connect. As in, water rises causing a float to move a lever closing the switch or your finger pushing a button closing the switch. Is this for the mixing station? I want to see pics when you get that thing built.

 

[shafiq_hossain]

A door bell would be what I would classify as a momentary switch. I would think I need one that will hold a state (OPEN or CLOSED) until pressed again. I wasn't too sure if the switches rated for 125VAC and so many amps would work. Would it need to be magnetic such as a float or door sensor?

 

[rdnelson]

You can get momentary switches and/or maintained contact switches in just about any form you want. As for the rating of the switch, you need to make sure it is rated for AT LEAST the voltage and amperage that will pass through it. So, if you are using 120 volts the switch has to be rated at least 120 volts. If you are running say an aqua lifter, the switch can be rated at one or two amps because the aqua lifter doesn't draw a higher current than that. But, if you are running a bigger pump, it may draw 10 amps in which case the switch would have to be rated at least 10 amps.

Hope that helps.

 

[shafiq_hossain]

So what rating should I be looking for if I hook it up to the Break Out Box where I also hook up the float switches and door alarm sensors. The switch will be used to turn the pump on or off but indirectly. Depending on the state of the switch, I will instruct Apex to turn on or off the outlet the pump is connected to. So, the switch will function exactly the same way as a float swtich or door sensor does.

 

[rdnelson]

If I understand what you are describing, the pump will run off of an outlet connected to the apex. That will have to be rated at least 120 volts and at least the amparage of the pump motor. If the switch is in line (in other words the current from the pump runs through it) then it also must have those ratings. If however, the switch is only activating a relay, it would need to be rated at least the voltage of the relay coil but amperage would be minor. In that case you could get by with something rated at only 1 or 2 amps.

I have never seen an apex or played with one so I am not sure of how they function. I would assume though that the actual load (pump voltage and amperage) run through the apex but something that acts like a relay.

 

[cr500_af]

Switch only activates relay. It can be pretty much any switch at Radio Shack. I built mine with four switch inputs (for float switches) and two momentary contact switches.

 

[rdnelson]

Did a quick search of the apex system and breakout box. It appears to me the breakout box is only a means to add inputs to the apex controller. That means, as cr500 af says, any switch will work. What ever voltage the apex runs off of will be low voltage and there will be no amperage to speak of running through the switch.

 

[krcraig1]

Good discussion. Following...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[cr500_af]

rdnelson99;744613 wrote: Did a quick search of the apex system and breakout box. It appears to me the breakout box is only a means to add inputs to the apex controller. That means, as cr500 af says, any switch will work. What ever voltage the apex runs off of will be low voltage and there will be no amperage to speak of running through the switch.

Exactly. As long as it makes/breaks contact it will work.

 

[shafiq_hossain]

rdnelson,

That is correct. The pump will run off of an outlet controlled by Apex. Thus, the switch and the outlet are related ONLY through programming. Essentially, the programming for the outlet is as follows (pseudocode):

If Pushbutton_Switch = OPEN Then ON (if the state of the pushbutton is ON, then turn on the power to this outlet)

It's no different than how the ATO pump connected to Apex is programmed. If the float switch = OPEN then the outlet which powers the ATO Pump would turn on. This would also be similar to how alarm systems work. If the door sensors are far apart, the state changes (OPEN or CLOSED). The control panel which the sensor is hooked up to senses the change in the state and activates the buzzer, sends a signal to the monitoring station, sends emails, etc....

So, putting aside everything else, do the float switches and/or door sensors work based on some current flowing through them? In other words, does the break out box send a continuous current to float switch and detects when there is a break in that loop? Or is the current already inherent within the float switch or door alarm sensor based on the magnetic properties it's design is based on?

 

[cr500_af]

If I'm not mistaken, the switch (when closed) completes a ground connection that the Apex senses, but no actual current flowing through. It doesn't work off of magnetic properties, which is why a regular pushbutton switch, a toggle switch or a microswitch will all do the job.

 

[shafiq_hossain]

Thanks. Time to pay a visit to Radio Shack, although most of the reviews on their pushbutton switches have been negative.

 

[cr500_af]

At least they are dirt cheap... pick up a couple of spares. For some reason, nothing breaks if I have a replacement on hand.

 

[realfish]

There is some programming for the "door bell" type switch in the "Apex Unofficial Users Guide" that's pretty close to what you are trying to do.

I'm not going to automate my water change quite as much as you, but I think I'll do the "doorbell" switch to turn the pump on and off. I have my tanks plumbed for water changes, but I will have to manually turn the valves on and off.

 

[rdnelson]

There has to be some current that originates from the apex and flows through the switch but it is probably minimal. Any switch should do. Basically the apex sends out a signal (current) on one wire and looks to see if it comes back on the other wire. If the switch is closed it will.

 

[shafiq_hossain]

Isn't there natural current flowing through the switch by virtue of it being connected to the ground lead?

 

[rdnelson]

Only if there is an imbalance but if everything is grounded and bonded correctly that should never happen. There must be a source of power. A switch would be like the ball valve in your plumbing. It doesn't create the current it just prevents or allows it to flow. The main difference is with a ball valve you can adjust how much water. With a switch it is all or nothing.

 

[lilrobb]

rdnelson99;744733 wrote: Only if there is an imbalance but if everything is grounded and bonded correctly that should never happen. There must be a source of power. A switch would be like the ball valve in your plumbing. It doesn't create the current it just prevents or allows it to flow. The main difference is with a ball valve you can adjust how much water. With a switch it is all or nothing.

Seems you have never seen a dimmer switch...