Wavemaker Pumps

[cameron]

The swirl pattern is to be avoided given his research as it creates an uneven flow at the top as opposed to the bottom and slows down as it crashes into rocks. Using two pumps on the left and two at the right facing each other switching on/off causes a great flow that circulates from top left to top right to bottom right to bottom left and back to top left.

I have the wavemaker portion just need the pumps and an OM is a couple hundred bucks more than I would like to invest in a test... unless of course it works like a champ.

 

[cameron]

Xyzpdq0121;40299 wrote: Being the youngest of 10 I can hold my own.... Except someone got me sick and I am off my game for a few days. I will have a comeback when I feel better.

The title change is comeback enough...

:shades:

 

[cameron]

That wavemaker has a lot of mixed reviews and isn't quite what I am looking for. I want the simplicity of four pumps creating the effects seen in Jake's studies. Basically I need a more effecient maxijet that isn't an arm and a leg. If I was going to spend $500+ on this I would probably go Vortech pumps or pull it out and load up on 4 tunzes.

You would think someone would create a more powerful MJ style magnet drive pump that can actually work with most wavemakers out there.

 

[cameron]

Found a pump that might work. Hagen Aquaclear. Post thoughts in this thread:

 

[dough]

The swirl pattern is to be avoided given his research as it creates an uneven flow at the top as opposed to the bottom and slows down as it crashes into rocks. Using two pumps on the left and two at the right facing each other switching on/off causes a great flow that circulates from top left to top right to bottom right to bottom left and back to top left.

My Vortech produces a very definite circular flow pattern in my tank. You can see the flow bouncing off the top of the far side and swirling around the bottom back to the pump. I am not sure that is good based upon what you are saying. My Oceans Motions closed loop is on all the time vs. the Vortech. That is cycles on for 20 minutes off for 10. 2 of OM return flow is in the direct path of the Vortech flow which gice me random flow patterns. So I am not sure if that is correct based upon what your saying.

Cameron, you're welcome to come see the Vortech in action. You have a big tank which is probably going to required some larger pumps vs. a MJ. Even a mod MJ flow pattern is more linear/straight lined than a Vortech and Tunze.

I saw a Tunze WaveBox in action not to long ago and the water movement that it was creating was pretty impressive across a large tank such as yours. That maybe out to the price range you where looking at.

 

[ejorg2]

Noob here.....Have you thought about a 3 way automatic valve. I had one on my solar pool heater in FL. Think it was a 12v. Should be able to set it on a timer. Not sure about the cost, but could easily be added to a closed loop. I think it was made by Jandy. I'll see if I can find anything about it on the net.

 

[cameron]

SCWD doesn't support enough flow. For 10 seconds you can only run 270gph.

 

[cameron]

Me too... looks like dual closed loops or punt and just get 4 6045s and be done with it.

 

[cameron]

Switching is easy. I will use the OSC command on my AquaController and alternate turning on each pump for 10 to 15 minutes. Problem with most pumps is the motor is attached to the prop so when it starts up it creates a lot of wear on the motor. MJs and typical submerged pumps like a mag use a magnet to spin the properllor around a shaft so there is no wear (well not nearly as much) on the motor turning it on and off as there is no water resistence to overcome.

 

[cameron]

I think the best options are a Tunze setup or two Vortechs on a wavemaker like a Chauvet, RK2 or AC. I think I am going to buy 4 6045s and run one side for twelve hours and then switch to the other that way I get an even distribution of flow across the corals.

 

[jmaneyapanda]

If you are looking for something small, use a MJ, cut off the nozzle with a hacksaw, and drill some approx 1/4" holes in the impeller shroud. The holes will allow additonal inflow, and with the nozzle gone, you'll get two benefits. First, the back pressure will be greatly reduced so you'll get higher flow (and wider disrtibution- not just a narrow jet), and second, since the impellar switched rotation direction randomly, it will become a truly random directional flow machine. It'll take you 3 minutes, and if you own a drill and a hacksaw- its free.

 

[cameron]

Higher flow good, but random flow bad. Point of this test is to get a unidirectional flow going and "rock" the tank back and forth with a long timed wave maker. Problem is nobody seems to make a good pump for this application. Maybe four MJs mounted to some black PVC wouldn't look horrible.

 

[matttvi]

someone on RC built their own wavemaker device using a modded maxi-jet on a controller, the design was pretty much identical to the TUNZE wave-box.

He built the box itself out of acrylic sheets. I'll try and find the thread.

here's the

 

[sammy33]

Great thread.

Cameron - you remember seeing my closed loop? The Dart with the OM 4-way is what I have. I actually read http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/1/aafeature/view?searchterm=flow">Jakes article on Gyre style flow </a>(after I did my CL plumbing :doh: ) and have been a bit disappointed with the results. Don't get me wrong...the flow is quite good in the tank but I think I could get even better results with a few changes based on what is being discussed here.

My current setup has the outputs pointing at each other. I have the version 3
drum on my OM 4-way that switches from outlets 1 & 3 to 2 & 4 and then back to 1 & 3.... like this (the blue arrows show the switching outputs):
[IMG]http://www.samsreef.com/images/closed-loop-animation1.gif" alt="" />

This causes the currents to collide and does create a good bit of turbulence and energy but it is confined to the areas where the water streams meet.

I have been thinking of redoing the outlets so that 1 & 3 and 2 & 4 are pointing in the same direction. This will help push the whole volume of water to one side of the tank with no opposing currents (rough photoshop edits to illustate the idea):
[IMG]http://www.samsreef.com/images/closed-loop-animation2.gif" alt="" />

The OM 4-way has a 1 RPM motor so the switching of currents happens every thirty seconds. While my idea of redoing the outlets to point the same way will help reduce the opposing currents the fast switching of the OM 4-way will not give the water enough time to gain maximum momentum. I am thinking about just using a timer on the OM. Set the timer to run the OM motor for 30 seconds (long enough to switch outlets) and then go off for 30 minutes, come back on for thirty seconds to switch the current and then off for 30 minutes again.

This is the best idea I could come up with using my existing equipment to acheive the Gyre style flow.

Another idea (getting back to your question) is to use the smaller submersible pumps (Mag drive 5 or Ocean Runner 2500, Eheim 1260, etc.) and do a simple above tank closed loop. Check out how this guy did his system - [IMG]http://themantledmonster.thereeftank.com/cpics.html">Closed loop idea</a>
[IMG]http://themantledmonster.thereeftank.com/pictures/clsabove.jpg alt="" />

This would allow you to get past the 300 gph barrier of most standard powerheads. You could also run these pumps on timers with minimal issues. The closed loop intake and outputs would also be a bit more stealthy than having big pumps in the tank and you would not have as many worries about livestock getting caught in the intake (if you use strainers).

 

[cameron]

That is EXACTLY what I was looking for on a simple closed loop setup. Easy to build and I can mount to my canopy. Will have to play with that.

Big thanks for the link.

As for your setup, the changes you suggested should be better. You could also just do two outlets on each side which in Jake's setups performed best.

 

[jmaneyapanda]

Another option I have heard about, but never seen or tried is the Wave2K. It supposedly makes great back and forth, with little energy consumption, noise, and heat.

 

[cameron]

I looked at the Wave2k a while back but recommended for my system would be well over $400 and crosssing into the Vortech/Tunze area. I just want to see what happens when I try this 10-15 minute wavemaker rocking setup. All my options start getting pricey real quick, but the dual simple closed loop looks good.