What's the best Ozonizer or Ozone Generator?

[seth the wine guy]

I'm looking to put one one my 200g total water volume tank. What is the baddest bad boy out there and why should I get an Ozonizer vs Generator?
I will not be running it through a skimmer but a dedicated reactor.

 

[lilrobb]

Ozonizer VS Generator?

Then Generator hands down - I mean, a poweroutage might kill your tank, the ozonizer just assist in keeping it pristine...

 

[grouper therapy]

ozotech is a nice brand

 

[skriz]

Ozotech hands down

 

[rbredding]

isnt' the Red Sea model with variable output also pretty decent?

 

[merkywater]

Check the link out Seth.

 

[grouper therapy]

Rbredding;645027 wrote: isnt' the Red Sea model with variable output also pretty decent?

I have had no service from the redsea unit and can't be repaired either

 

[rbredding]

ok...

didn't know you had one of them...

good to know (looks more expensive anyway)

 

[grouper therapy]

Rbredding;645042 wrote: ok...

didn't know you had one of them...

good to know (looks more expensive anyway)

Yea Ron have tried to of them with no good results.

 

[cr500_af]

How do those of you who use ozone check the required amount? I understand that ORP probes are prone to dying young. I did read about a method to set it up once, very much on the conservative side, and not rely on any other controls (therefore a dead ORP probe wouldn't matter; it is only used during initial setup and adjustment).

 

[grouper therapy]

I use no controller as the ozotech that I use is not large enough to overdose my system

Edit:

andregarcia_73;645068 wrote: My guess is its best to get one with a built in controller. Is that right?

I don't care for those models as I said earlier they are usually not servicable.

 

[seth the wine guy]

I use no controller as the ozotech that I use is not large enough to overdose my system

Dave, do you use the 100 or 200mg? What reactor are you putting it through? (Since we all know you don't have a skimmer!)

 

[grouper therapy]

100mg it actually belongs to ERICB an old diy skimmer is what it runs through for that purpose only

 

[acroholic]

Seth,
One thing to remember about ozone treatment of water: most people use one of two ways to administer it, either via a protein skimmer or a reactor. You also need to decide if you are going to use carbon post injection to get rid of the excess ozone.

I use a reactor type setup, and all water leaving the reactor is filtered through carbon, and all air venting from the reactor is vented through carbon as well. In a setup like this you can literally blast the water with as much ozone as you want, because none is getting added back into the system. You won't see a spike in system ORP in a setup like this because the ozone is applied and removed separate from the DT. The ORP inside the reactor is where the high ORP readings would be had.

The other setup is through a protein skimmer. O3 is injected directly into the skimmer. If all the water exiting the skimmer is run through carbon, then you are not adding any O3 to the system water itself. But if you are using O3 without carbon filtration, then you should see an increase in system ORP because you are adding ozone to the system water directly. In Skimmer application, some O3 will also off gas through the skimmer collection cup into the room the equipment is in. If this is run through carbon, then you should not be able to smell it.

Most O3 users on the ARC, from what I see, use O3 in low dose form via skimmer application and don't worry about carbon post filtration. They just use it in a low enough mg/hour rate so it does not spike the system ORP to dangerous levels (>450 millivolts). The upside to this is less maintenance and monitoring of separate equipment. The downside of this is less control and effectiveness of the O3, as water clarity is about all the visible results you can see with low dose O3 application. You can crank the O3 up to deadly levels in a reactor without risk to your tank corals or fish because the actual O3 application is in the reactor only, and excess O3 is removed via carbon prior to being returned to the system water.

Per the Ozotech Technical Support person: the carbon used is not degraded by the ozone passing through it. It merely knocks off the extra O2 molecule from the O3 passing over it. Post O3 carbon should be changed every 6 months or so.

The above based on my understanding of O3 application.

For a skimmer setup the equipment requirements are simpler as well. You only need the O3 generator and some ozone safe tubing. The venturi action of the skimmer pulls O3 into the skimmer. For an O3 reactor setup you need a Tetra (now Coralife) Luft pump, the O3 generator, the O3 reactor, post reactor carbon media reactor, reactor feed pump (typically mag 3,5, or 7 or similar) O3 resistant check valve, O3 resistant tubing, and carbon air filter container.

With either of the above setups, you need to decide if you want to use an air dryer. These use a rechargeable dessicant bead, and are a PIA to deal with, so many don't use them. I don't. What this means is that you need to rinse out the O3 generator's insides once in a while with water to flush out any nitric acid that may form from not using an air dryer. This is done by pushing water through the "in" port on the O3 generator a few times and letting it drain out the "out" port. O3 generators don't produce as much O3 in humid environments, but with a variable O3 generator like the Poseidon, you can just turn up production a bit to compensate.

 

[skriz]

Acroholic;645086 wrote: ...I use a reactor type setup, and all water leaving the reactor is filtered through carbon, and all air venting from the reactor is vented through carbon as well. In a setup like this you can literally blast the water with as much ozone as you want, because none is getting added back into the system. You won't see a spike in system ORP in a setup like this because the ozone is applied and removed separate from the DT. The ORP inside the reactor is where the high ORP readings would be had...

Not entirely true. You can most definitely see a spike in ORP by using a reactor. ORP isn't tied to excess O3 "floating" in your display. Anything can affect your ORP: water changes, carbon, UV, etc.

With either method, reactor or skimmer, you're applying some sort of limiting factor; be it a low dose or lower exposure period. Both have a potential to raise ORP.

From what I have seen, you don't need as much O3 as you would think. O3 is very good at what it does, and as long as you're keeping up with your husbandry, your water clarity shouldn't be horrible to deal with. Thus, you'll need very little O3 to get/maintain crystal clear water.

When I used an ORP controller for my ozone, I noticed after a while, the O3 generator rarely turned on as my ORP levels stayed at a pretty consistent level (and yes, I did maintain the probe).

My favorite method has been a timed method. I'm going to start using O3 again, but will only run it for X minutes every month/2 weeks or so via my Apex.

 

[lilrobb]

LilRobb;645016 wrote: Ozonizer VS Generator?

Then Generator hands down - I mean, a poweroutage might kill your tank, the ozonizer just assist in keeping it pristine...

I didn't read correctly - you meant an OZONE generator, sorry my post clearly missed the topic!

 

[grouper therapy]

Skriz;645114 wrote: Not entirely true. You can most definitely see a spike in ORP by using a reactor. ORP isn't tied to excess O3 "floating" in your display. Anything can affect your ORP: water changes, carbon, UV, etc.

With either method, reactor or skimmer, you're applying some sort of limiting factor; be it a low dose or lower exposure period. Both have a potential to raise ORP.

From what I have seen, you don't need as much O3 as you would think. O3 is very good at what it does, and as long as you're keeping up with your husbandry, your water clarity shouldn't be horrible to deal with. Thus, you'll need very little O3 to get/maintain crystal clear water.

When I used an ORP controller for my ozone, I noticed after a while, the O3 generator rarely turned on as my ORP levels stayed at a pretty consistent level (and yes, I did maintain the probe).

My favorite method has been a timed method. I'm going to start using O3 again, but will only run it for X minutes every month/2 weeks or so via my Apex.

I think Dave was referring to all the water out of the reactor being passed over the carbon as to this type of setup.

 

[acroholic]

Skriz;645114 wrote: Not entirely true. You can most definitely see a spike in ORP by using a reactor. ORP isn't tied to excess O3 "floating" in your display. Anything can affect your ORP: water changes, carbon, UV, etc.

With either method, reactor or skimmer, you're applying some sort of limiting factor; be it a low dose or lower exposure period. Both have a potential to raise ORP.

A reactor with GAC post filtration prevents excess O3 from entering the system, and at least from what I have read, is considered the safest way to apply ozone in a reef tank, at least in higher amounts. However, I would monitor system ORP and if levels were to get unsafe, over 450 mv, then I would back off on the amount of ozone or the amount of time I use it. The limiting factor you stated.

In my system, I run my Poseidon full on 24/7, and I monitor system ORP, but don't control my reactor with it. I use GAC post reactor, and my properly maintained and regularly calibrated ORP meter never gets above 330.

My ORP crashes for a short time after I feed my fish.

 

[jmaneyapanda]

ORP is a measure completely independent of ozone. As Skriz said, high ORP can bd achieved by different means, other than ozone. Ozone is an oxidative agent that is caustic to livestock, which is why we remove it. The high ORP is merely an indicator that ozone may be present.

 

[acroholic]

jmaneyapanda;645196 wrote: ORP is a measure completely independent of ozone. As Skriz said, high ORP can bd achieved by different means, other than ozone. Ozone is an oxidative agent that is caustic to livestock, which is why we remove it. The high ORP is merely an indicator that ozone may be present.

ORP is a voltage measurement of the overall potential of oxidizers (+ charged ions like ozone) in our tank water to accept electrons from reducing agents (- charged ions), including those organics we want to remove from our systems. For example, organics that color our tank water.

Ozone is a powerful oxidizer, and while ozone is a substance and ORP is a voltage measurement, and may be separate, excess ozone in tank water will raise ORP by increasing the positive voltage measured by the ORP probe.

A higher ORP is beneficial to a point, but over a certain level you will oxidize coral and fish flesh as well as excess organics.

Yes, you can raise the ORP of your tank water by different means, like removing contaminants (reducing agents) through water changes, mechanical filtration, skimming, UV, but I have never experienced or read of ORP being raised to dangerous levels thru regular tank maintenance.

That is why it is important to monitor ORP when you use ozone, because it can raise ORP to a much higher degree than something like a water change. There is a big difference in using ozone vs regular maintenance practices because of how quickly ozone can be overdosed in a reef system.

The above JMO.