Ah ok , well keep me posted man , will you post a before picture of you tank?
Your Experience with LEDS
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Sure no problem I'll grab one tomorrow when the MH are on. You may need to remind me
seth the wine guy
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Ok, now I'll run through the LED's crowd of fans and throw muck and see if i can stir it into a frenzied mob.
You have a very nice looking tank, so please don't get me wrong and take offense. But, no. I would not consider it an acro tank. As you say, not your thing. My advice to the OP was if an Acro tank WAS his thing. <u>And remember what the OP's thread was created for and about. LIGHTING</u>.
SPS dominant? Ok, first off I see 4-5 different birds nest colonies and two monti caps, each a different color. Prime example of why I say to not confuse SPS dominant with an Acro dominant tank. You can practically grow those with a Coleman camping lantern. And actually, having sponsors buy the coral doesn't say much at all. All the smoking hot corals are usually found from other reefers on boards like this. Heck, sponsors sell things we can't give away here like green palys and monti cap. I usually dump most of my frags at sponsors because I don't like the hassle of dealing with people here. Your tank obviously lacked flow needed for acros evidenced by their growth patterns. Long, spindly branches on those torts are indicative of less than ideal water movement. This often gives an illusion of faster growth as well.
You could have probably stopped right there. But, employing methods of deciphering though context clues might help you to understand things you read in the future.
I wouldn't ask a Catholic priest about the best place to pick up hot chicks and I put no faith in people who give advice based on "what they've seen" or "what they heard". I prefer to hear from those who did it. Reggie is one of a handful of people I know ANYWHERE in this hobby that knows Acros like he does. Reggie is too humble to tell people exactly to what degree of understanding is needed to do what he has done, and most people are too naive to realize it. Reggie has fragged by weight more acros out of his tank than most of you have grown in total weight.
I'll use an analogy you can probably more easily grasp. You can get a tattoo from a guy with this:
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Or you can get a tattoo from a guy with this:
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Both these guys will put some ink on you and can have the same end product. One will just require more work to get the desired end result. So, if endless hours of self inflicted pain is your thing, I won't judge. :tongue:
Bottom line is LEDs will grow anything if given proper effort. (Reggie) It's just much easier with MH.
You have a very nice looking tank, so please don't get me wrong and take offense. But, no. I would not consider it an acro tank. As you say, not your thing. My advice to the OP was if an Acro tank WAS his thing. <u>And remember what the OP's thread was created for and about. LIGHTING</u>.
SPS dominant? Ok, first off I see 4-5 different birds nest colonies and two monti caps, each a different color. Prime example of why I say to not confuse SPS dominant with an Acro dominant tank. You can practically grow those with a Coleman camping lantern. And actually, having sponsors buy the coral doesn't say much at all. All the smoking hot corals are usually found from other reefers on boards like this. Heck, sponsors sell things we can't give away here like green palys and monti cap. I usually dump most of my frags at sponsors because I don't like the hassle of dealing with people here. Your tank obviously lacked flow needed for acros evidenced by their growth patterns. Long, spindly branches on those torts are indicative of less than ideal water movement. This often gives an illusion of faster growth as well.
You could have probably stopped right there. But, employing methods of deciphering though context clues might help you to understand things you read in the future.
I wouldn't ask a Catholic priest about the best place to pick up hot chicks and I put no faith in people who give advice based on "what they've seen" or "what they heard". I prefer to hear from those who did it. Reggie is one of a handful of people I know ANYWHERE in this hobby that knows Acros like he does. Reggie is too humble to tell people exactly to what degree of understanding is needed to do what he has done, and most people are too naive to realize it. Reggie has fragged by weight more acros out of his tank than most of you have grown in total weight.
I'll use an analogy you can probably more easily grasp. You can get a tattoo from a guy with this:
Or you can get a tattoo from a guy with this:
Both these guys will put some ink on you and can have the same end product. One will just require more work to get the desired end result. So, if endless hours of self inflicted pain is your thing, I won't judge. :tongue:
Bottom line is LEDs will grow anything if given proper effort. (Reggie) It's just much easier with MH.
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IME and vast reading on the subject at hand I believe T5's and LED's are the best 1-2 combo punch one can have on a tank. I strongly believe MH's are a thing of the past that will become obsolete with the advancements of LED's along with T5's. MH's just don't make sense anymore with how much you can get from T5's and LED's on a power consumption level alone. LED's will give you that shimmer look while the T5's will take care of the growth aspect. Not saying LED's will not give you growth it's just that when combined with T5's welcome to a whole new level. LED/T5 combo any day of the week over MH's.
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I will agree with your last sentence Seth.
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Seth: i had two mp40wes. Def not lacking flow.
Led debate will always go on. But one thing is for sure, if u dont agree with Seth then your wrong!
I said it was sps dominate not acro dominate
lol coleman lantern
Led debate will always go on. But one thing is for sure, if u dont agree with Seth then your wrong!
I said it was sps dominate not acro dominate
lol coleman lantern
Now Now , I didn't mean to start a fight.
This is a healthy debate. Seth, your last statement IMO is an accurate one. As a building engineer I have to spec lighting all the time. The difference is VERY simple. You pointed all the obvious reasons why LED's are an attractive option to begin with all the obvious benefits. However, it simply boils down to what do lights do... They have a kelvin rating (temperature/color), a CRI rating, a par value, also wattage (power consumption that is consumed). No matter what, LED's, MH, T5's they ALL have these values. It's a matter of achieving the needs for a desired result. So let's be clear, I haven't been in the hobby for very long and what I gather is, a heavy Acro tank using MH is EASIER to achieve that success. My conclusion is, want the easy path go MH and deal with bulb replacement(light degradation), heavy power consumption, and heat displacement. Go with LED, deal with none of the negative attributes of a MH BUT deal with the learning curve and patients of dialing your lights in.
I'm curious, you said you've tried several LED fixtures of the corse of your time. A few of with have only been on the market 2 years... It's taken me a year to get my fixture dialed in... I'm not confident you've allowed enough time to compare a fair judgment.
I'm curious, you said you've tried several LED fixtures of the corse of your time. A few of with have only been on the market 2 years... It's taken me a year to get my fixture dialed in... I'm not confident you've allowed enough time to compare a fair judgment.
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using the tattoo gun analogy ..... that was brilliant
seth the wine guy
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You mean to say you looked at a flow chart that told you 2 MP40's was enough for your size tank and that's why you think it's enough? That's the problem with so many reefers. They look at chart or a number to tell them what they need instead of looking at their corals to tell them. I run four MP40's on my 120g and I'm debating on adding my spare as a fifth. Doesn't matter how much water is being moved by any given pump if it isn't being moved to the areas that need it due to aquascaping and coral colonies blocking a pathway. It's painfully obviously your tort lacks a growth pattern anything remotely resembling a wild grown colony. And if what we are doing is not to strive to replicate naturally occurring conditions conducive to our inhabitants wellbeing, what are we doing?
-AI's - 4/11-5/12 and still currently own and use for frag tank and supplemental lighting
-Radion (First Gen) 3/12-10/12 Saw the best colors develop of any of the fixtures but terrible growth
-Kessils 9/13-Today The Kessil 360w has provided the best results thus far with balance of growth, color, and depth penetration. Shimmer exceeds that of the MH.
I want very badly for a LED fixture that's a plug and play that performs as well and consistently as MH. The upgrade of my tank awaits it. I do have a fundamental problem with the concept that a light should need "dialing" in to the degree that it takes a year for it to happen. Something I've noticed is acros have difficulty going from MH to LED but no issues going from LED to MH. (Because they're back to the place that feels like home?) This would lead me to believe we are forcing the corals to process things in a way that is unnatural to them under LEDs. Can we manipulate them and give them a choice to either live a certain way or die? Yes. As humans we do it everyday but it doesn't mean we're happy or healthy. Some will adapt as best they can but it usually results in a weakened creature. So, that goes back to needing to compensate with even higher water quality standards, etc. I battle enough demons with 20+ fish in a 120g. (3 of which are dirty tangs and 7 others are species that require several feedings a day to thrive.)
