newbie question about domino damsel

[marcy]

I have a 48-gal saltwater tank that I started several months ago. I got some bad advice at first and cycled the tank with 3 damsels. When it was done cycling I picked up 2 false percs. They're doing very well, but one of the damsels is a fairly aggressive domino, and now that it's been awhile, he's really grown alarmingly. All 5 fish are getting enough to eat, but the two other damsels (green chromis and Talbot's) are still about the same size and now hide almost all the time. The clowns used to act a little aggressive toward the domino, but not anymore. And the domino has probably tripled in size. He's pretty much uncatchable, so my question is this: Do I need to just suck it up and take all the live rock and stuff out of the tank so I can catch him and give him away? I would really hate it if he hurt the clowns (although, to be fair, there's been no sign of fighting or anything). I was thinking of adding another fish or two soon, or even maybe starting on some corals if I can scrape up the cash, and I want to make sure that if it's necessary he come out, I do it before I try any of that.

As a followup, if I have to remove him, does anybody in the Decatur area have a good home to offer a small (but growing), entertaining, fairly aggressive damsel? :tongue:

 

[wbrown]

take him to your lfs and ask to trade him, or donate him if you have no other alternative, offer him to the fishie whirlpool.
get yourself a new trashcan or a lot of buckets and drain the water down to reduce the hiding places for the fish, then scoop him up.

 

[marcy]

I know, I was very concerned when I added the clowns (and even my urchin, because hey, you never know) but was unable to catch the domino then... and no problems so far. But he's getting so big, and since my eventual goal is a mandarinfish.... I guess he's got to go. Poor Guinness

...yes, I name my fish.

 

[chymos45]

First off, welcome to the addiction! Glad to have you. You will find many helpful and knowledgable folks on this forum.
As for the domino, lesson learned. Always make your fish purchases based on adult sizing, temperment, and compatibility. Some people have greater succes with certain species than others, but as a noob, don't hesitate to ask questions and RESEARCH as much as you can. Read, read, read, ask, read, ask, and read some more - then make a decision.
IME, agressive little guys like your domino are easily caught by a quick scoop at feeding time. He's probably the first one in line at the dinner table and may be an easy catch with a quick net. I don't like using nets because of their potential to damage fins/scales and you'll see most LFS's use the plastic specimen containers, but these guys are fine with a fine mesh net.
Draining down the water as wbrown suggests is another option, as is a fish trap.
One other way that worked well for me in the past is to put your net in the water and herd him around a little bit to see which corner he likes to hide. Place a clear specimen container in that corner, use the net to herd him into the container, and use the net as a cover for the container to keep him from getting back out. This takes timing and patience, but is another option in your arsenal.

 

[marcy]

Thanks for the welcome

And unfortunately I did my job a little too well in arranging the live rock- there's always a way for him to zip around the back. I tried plastic containers, mesh nets, waiting with the net in the water, feeding 'em... he's just too quick. After two hours I gave up. I think I'll have to take out the rock (or water, as you suggested) and get him that way.

I wonder if I should take out the other two damsels while I'm at it? They seem very docile so far, much MUCH more so than the clowns. But I don't want to do this more than once. *ponder*

 

[chymos45]

I COMPLETELY understand your reservation to dismantle the rocks. I suffer from the same hesitation, as do many other members.

One more thing to try before you tear it all down is the fish trap. Maybe there's a member that would loan you one, or you could purchase one from a sponsor store. Basically, it's a clear container with a trap door. You put food in the trap, wait until he swims in for the food, and close the door. There's another DIY version with a bottle and an inverted top that makes it difficult for a fish to find his way out.

http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/fish_trap.php">http://www.cichlid-forum.com/articles/fish_trap.php</a>

Either one typically works well with a pushy fish.

 

[seedless reefer]

wbrown;343033 wrote: offer him to the fishie whirlpool.

Just wow.

I'm sorry but this is poor, irresponsible advice and I'm sure that while many people think it is ok to flush lowly damsels, I would be willing to bet that this does not reflect the sentiment of the majority in this club.

Willingly sending a fish to it's death because you are disenchanted with it for whatever reason is cruel, inhumane treatment of an animal in your care and personally I can't understand this school of thought.

You can buy/rent a trap and someone, somewhere will re-home him.

Welcome to the ARC and good luck.

You are not the first and will not be the last to fall into the damsel trap.

 

[drnecropolis]

Seedless Reefer;343050 wrote: Just wow.

I'm sorry but this is poor, irresponsible advice and I'm sure that while many people think it is ok to flush lowly damsels, I would be willing to bet that this does not reflect the sentiment of the majority in this club.

Willingly sending a fish to it's death because you are disenchanted with it for whatever reason is cruel, inhumane treatment of an animal in your care and personally I can't understand this school of thought.

You can buy/rent a trap and someone, somewhere will re-home him.

Welcome to the ARC and good luck.

You are not the first and will not be the last to fall into the damsel trap.

+1

Dont know how I skimmed over that..

 

[marcy]

That fish trap article is a great idea, I'll try it as soon as I get home.

And as far as the "fishie whirlpool" goes, I would NEVER. I love my little aggro fishie, even if I can't keep him. Actually, he gets more admiring comments from people than anything else in my tank- he'll be great for someone with a more aggressive tank.

 

[jennm]

I see somebody beat me to the punch on the "burial at sea" option. It never ceases to amaze me that people consider this an option for some, yet prize some other specimens.

Many LFS will take them in, and the domino will make a suitable tankmate in a different situation.

To answer the other question, I'd probably remove all the damsels except the chromis - typically the chromis are much more suitable, attitude-wise, for community tanks. Talbot's... 'may be' ok but if in doubt, get it out - then you only have to do it once.

I don't like damsels - never have... because most people end up with 'buyer's remorse' at some point with them. Unless that's all you intend to keep, I'd get them all out (except the chromis).

And... WELCOME!

Jenn

 

[wbrown]

Seedless Reefer;343050 wrote: Just wow.


Willingly sending a fish to it's death because you are disenchanted with it for whatever reason is cruel, inhumane treatment of an animal in your care and personally I can't understand this school of thought.

Please note that was NOT my first option... I'm not cruel and heartless by any means. I've had fish that I could not give away and resided in a sump or FOWLR tank if I had one, however not everyone has this option available to them.

 

[marcy]

Well, there's some cheerful news, at least If the chromis is suitable, the Talbot's will be, as well- I don't know about the species in general, but this particular specimen is far more timid than even the chromis. Thanks!!

JennM;343061 wrote: I see somebody beat me to the punch on the "burial at sea" option. It never ceases to amaze me that people consider this an option for some, yet prize some other specimens.

Many LFS will take them in, and the domino will make a suitable tankmate in a different situation.

To answer the other question, I'd probably remove all the damsels except the chromis - typically the chromis are much more suitable, attitude-wise, for community tanks. Talbot's... 'may be' ok but if in doubt, get it out - then you only have to do it once.

I don't like damsels - never have... because most people end up with 'buyer's remorse' at some point with them. Unless that's all you intend to keep, I'd get them all out (except the chromis).

And... WELCOME!

Jenn

 

[jennm]

Well, if you feel that euthanasia is the only option, there are certainly more humane ways of doing it.

Firstly - I don't ever see a reason to off a perfectly healthy specimen. Most LFS will take them in. Some offer credit, some don't but it's better to give it away than take its life - your "gain" is the same either way.

Secondly, if euthanasia is chosen, put it in a bag of tank water and place it in the freezer - it will slow down its metabolism and it will "be put to sleep".

I realize you probably weren't suggesting the OP take that route, but please do understand that a post with such a lackadaisical opinion of the life of a fish is bound to generate some criticism.

I'm not flaming you - honestly - just offering up better options than killing a fish that is healthy and behaving normally for its specie.

Rehoming it is the first and best option - and in this part of the world, 100% doable.

Jenn

 

[drnecropolis]

Ive always thought if you were going to put a fish to sleep it would be more humane to use clove oil instead of freezing them to death..

 

[lees]

I fell for the Domino trap myself. I did find someone on here to take him so hopefully you will be able to do the same. It was hard to get rid of him because I had him for almost a year. I can't believe anyone would suggest flushing a living breathing creature that they wrongfully or unknowingly mistakenly purchased. Anyhow good luck with it I know he will be difficult to catch so you may as well just go ahead and dismantle your rockwork and drain some water. I think they know once you get after them what's going on and I also think they are too smart for the traps.

 

[wbrown]

If I'd have remotely thought this would turn into a public flogging, I would have kept my fingers off the keyboard.
We were all newbies once, and most started without the advantage of a RR tank and sump. My assumption was Marcy may NOT have a place to house the little guy until a permanent home could be secured, and She apparently wanted the domino OUT based on the statement that She'd been trying and failing to catch the critter.
Still assuming that the fish was captured at lights on, or lights out the fish would have to be secured for several hours or overnight to get it to a LFS, the stress may have an adverse effect and ultimately lead to the demise of said fish.
So, with the permission of you Pious, self-righteous few that decided to take this off topic to persecute me for my statement will offer the lady some advice on how and when it's best to catch this fish, lets move on.
Marcy, I apologize for this display. It was not my intent to suggest that you flush the fish first, nor was it my intent to get flamed and distract the thread from you getting the answer(s) you seek.
-Wayne

 

[marcy]

LeeS;343072 wrote: I fell for the Domino trap myself. I did find someone on here to take him so hopefully you will be able to do the same. It was hard to get rid of him because I had him for almost a year. I can't believe anyone would suggest flushing a living breathing creature that they wrongfully or unknowingly mistakenly purchased. Anyhow good luck with it I know he will be difficult to catch so you may as well just go ahead and dismantle your rockwork and drain some water. I think they know once you get after them what's going on and I also think they are too smart for the traps.

well, I'll give the trap a try, but then take apart the rocks if I have to. Luckily for me (and the fish) I live maaybe 5 minutes from KeenReef and am sure Tim will take him if need be, because he's awesome that way.

 

[chymos45]

Haven't met Tim myself, but seems to be a fabulous guy and a great ARC sponsor. I am sure they will re-home the little guy if you don't find a member that wants him.

 

[marcy]

wbrown;343073 wrote: If I'd have remotely thought this would turn into a public flogging, I would have kept my fingers off the keyboard.
We were all newbies once, and most started without the advantage of a RR tank and sump. My assumption was Marcy may NOT have a place to house the little guy until a permanent home could be secured, and She apparently wanted the domino OUT based on the statement that She'd been trying and failing to catch the critter.
Still assuming that the fish was captured at lights on, or lights out the fish would have to be secured for several hours or overnight to get it to a LFS, the stress may have an adverse effect and ultimately lead to the demise of said fish.
So, with the permission of you Pious, self-righteous few that decided to take this off topic to persecute me for my statement will offer the lady some advice on how and when it's best to catch this fish, lets move on.
Marcy, I apologize for this display. It was not my intent to suggest that you flush the fish first, nor was it my intent to get flamed and distract the thread from you getting the answer(s) you seek.
-Wayne

I totally didn't mean to start anything like this
Wayne, I think I took your advice in the not-serious tone you intended, so no worries (and you are correct is your assumptions about my equipment)... and everybody else, I REALLY appreciate the cautions in case I had been a person who thought flushing was a viable option. The ASPCA would be proud

 

[jennm]

Wayne, nobody was flogging you. Just pointing out that it's not a good option. At the very least it's not "politically correct".

Dr.Necropolis - you are probably right about the clove oil - but it may not be something that folks have handy. I know it's a substance used as a capture chemical (and I don't condone that...but that's another post)... they would have to know how much to use, etc. The freezer option is one that is used to euthanize sick fish, and is generally considered to be humane.

Marcy, I'm glad you have a nearby option. That sounds like the best option.

Cheers,
Jenn