palytoxins

[ralph atl]

Wow, 'hope all is well and recover quick!

that is some serious toxins! thanks for sharing a reminder to all!

 

[jswizzle]

I had the same thing happen to me. Didn't go to the doc but I felt horrible like death for about a day and then it started fading away. Never had anything like that happen in my life. It's definitely a freeky feeling!!!

 

[containerman1]

coral_hog;805295 wrote: I don't think that peope really know just how dangerous these zoas are. About 5 years ago I had a similiar experience, but with me, I was hospitalized for 4 days and was put on assisted breathing until the toxin made it's way out of my bloood stream. In fact the poision control center out of Washington DC contacted me requesting the coral because the stran of the toxin was one that they did not have record of. Anyway, since that experience, I immediately rid my tank of all zoas.. and over the years, totally switchd gears and started keeping fish only. Like you mentioned earlier in one of the above posts, it's better to be safe than sorry.

I am very glad you recovered well I will definitely downsize my zoanthids and plays. I love fish also and I will continue to work toward a sps and lps but this has open my eyes to how powerful the toxins really are.

Edit:

JeF4y;805304 wrote: Shane, thanks for sharing your story and I hope this reply finds you well. ALL of our tanks are absolutely no joke and need to be treated with respect at all times. There are posts every few months on various reef forums that are either the same as this, or someone who breaks skin on a rock and ends up with an infection that goes septic on them. It gets nasty.

Very scary and sobering reminder to keep our hands OUT of the tanks without gloves. At one point my wife was going to buy a venomous fish to force me to wear gloves. I got the point and have been wearing them since lol.

Speedy recovery!

Thank you
The bad thing is I have a pair of long reef rubber gloves I purchased for my son and myself and they were right there. I guess I was one of the millions of people that think it wasn't going to be bad but I figured it out the hard way and I feel like a dumb*** but I did learn a valuable lesson and I will have gloves on every time my hand goes in the tank from here on out.

Edit:

mysterybox;805306 wrote: Wow, 'hope all is well and recover quick!

that is some serious toxins! thanks for sharing a reminder to all!

Thank you
I hope to get released this morning and get home watch a little football in my own recliner and relax because Whewww after I realized what had happened and read all the studies on palytoxins it had me pretty stressed.
They really can hurt you in a split second.
Thanks again
shane

Edit:

I had the same thing happen to me. Didn't go to the doc but I felt horrible like death for about a day and then it started fading away. Never had anything like that happen in my life. It's definitely a freeky feeling!!![/QUOTE

I am very glad you were OK. I thought about waiting it out but I thought I had better let them check me out. I still feel pretty shakey and my chest hurts and tight and body aches and a major headache.
Next time I would take a trip to the Dr asap. Just to be safe .They said sometimes depending on what your doing it enters your system and if your active it gets to your lungs and heart very quick and you can have respiratory shut down or your throat can swell shut. I went to bed and it slowed down the process but it hit me hard after a few hours and I knew I didn't want to wait just in case it continued to get worse.

 

[swfk44]

glad your feeling better and thanks for the reminder, i bought some armpit lengh pvc gloves and have not been using them, guess i need to get them back out.

Edit:

The-Bubonic-One;805170 wrote: Sorry to hear bro. Hope you bounce back fast. You could just give me all your zoa/paly so this never happens again:fing02:

:lol2:

 

[raz0945]

We hope you get better soon! Thank you for reminding us that this can happen when we get to comfortable with our tanks and animals. I am one of the biggest offenders of this rule and I do know better. Holley

 

[frantz]

Glad you made it out alright. From what I've read not all zoas and palys produce the toxin, though I'm not sure. It seems like one of those things most of us are smart enough to consider, but the few problems makes us complacent sometimes. Would you mind posting some pictures of the species you have? I'd be curious in identifying "safe" species if they exist as well as dangerous ones. Not that I have the time, but information collection starts somewhere

 

[containerman1]

Frantz;805328 wrote: Glad you made it out alright. From what I've read not all zoas and palys produce the toxin, though I'm not sure. It seems like one of those things most of us are smart enough to consider, but the few problems makes us complacent sometimes. Would you mind posting some pictures of the species you have? I'd be curious in identifying "safe" species if they exist as well as dangerous ones. Not that I have the time, but information collection starts somewhere

Here is some info I was shown with zoa and paly

The zooanthids are small and colorful soft corals that include zoanthus (zoa) and palythoa (paly) polyps . Despite obvious similarities between the two polyp types, there are a number of significant differences as well. Palythoa, or button polyps, comprise growths of polyps which resemble tiny sea anemones, although they are more closely related to corals than to anemones. Zoanthus, like palythoa polyps, are joined along their base and form a continual mat, but this base is not as thick as in the case of palythoa. The tentacles of zoanthus polyps are longer than those of the palythoa polyps. Select palythoa species are toxic, including Palythoa toxica and Palythoa tuberculosa


Zoanthus polyps, or sea mats, which are in the group of zoanthids, are colonies of relatively small polyps that are normally less than 1/2 inch in diameter. These polyps grow as encrusting mats from which the short polyps emerge. The thick matlike tissue which joins them is termed the coenenchyme. Palythoa polyps form a thicker base than the zoanthus polyps. This encrusting, clumplike coenenchyme is easily visible, as the individual polyps do not stick up as much as in the zoanthus types. Sea sand and shell fragments are also caught in this bases, which is not the case with the zoanthus type organisms

Currents and Toxins

Zoanthus colonies in the marine aquarium require fairly strong currents to bring their plankton diet to them. Palythoa colonies are less dependent on a strong current, as they will capture tiny marine creatures which crawl over their polyps. Palythoa polypîs produce a more deadly toxin than zoanthus colonies. This toxin, termed palytoxin, is located in the mucus that covers the polyps and they should only be handled with gloves.
I will attach pics with this soon but I have a large collection of zoanthids and probly 15-20 large 20-30 polyp palythoa frags. I believe Armor of God paly, Wow palys, magician play ,candy apple rainbow paly ,nuclear green button palys, everlasting gobstopper play , Tyree blue eyes paly, Rainbow paly, I think the goochsters are plays also, I have couple hundred Mohawk plays,lunar eclipse paly, several Darth maul plays,
I will attach some pics soon

Edit:

swfk44;805317 wrote: glad your feeling better and thanks for the reminder, i bought some armpit lengh pvc gloves and have not been using them, guess i need to get them back out.

Edit:
:lol2:

I had purchased a pair of these awhile back also and I really wish I would have just grabbed them and slipped them on. Whewww it would have saved me a lot of stress

 

[Jaycen B.]

C129H223N3O54...

If you are still having chest pain or head ach have them give you some isosorbide or nitro and lots of water. This will help couner the vascular constriction that is caused by palytoxin.

http://www.cbwinfo.com/Biological/Toxins/Palytoxin.html">http://www.cbwinfo.com/Biological/Toxins/Palytoxin.html</a>

Ask me how I know....

 

[containerman1]

Jaycen B.;805367 wrote: C129H223N3O54...

If you are still having chest pain or head ach have them give you some isosorvide or nitro and lots of water. This will help couner the vascular constriction that is caused by palytoxin.

http://www.cbwinfo.com/Biological/Toxins/Palytoxin.html">http://www.cbwinfo.com/Biological/Toxins/Palytoxin.html</a>

Ask me how I know....[/QUOTE]

Thank you
I did look up your instance in the search and I'm glad you were OK. They have treated me with all of the above and then some. Actually someone has contacted me from the CDC that has been working on a large article on this and I gave them some info and I plan on giving them a few samples of the palys to see if it can help.
I feel much better after the vascular constriction has lightened up. I also have asthma and that compounds the issues and seems to be a common key in people who actually go to the Dr when they get the poison in there system it makes the reaction feel much more intense

 

[Jaycen B.]

I would be interested in talking with them as well. Can you ask them if it would be ok for you to give me their contact info?

And thanks, I am glad you are ok also.

 

[containerman1]

Jaycen B.;805372 wrote: I would be interested in talking with them as well. Can you ask them if it would be ok for you to give me their contact info?

And thanks, I am glad you are ok also.

I sure will

 

[jennm]

Wow - just found this thread after reading that you were home from hospital - I missed this thread totally.

Glad you're OK.

Jenn

 

[ichthyoid]

Glad you are doing better and will be ok.

FWIW- I ended up in my Doctor's office on an nebulizer/inhaler plus O2 and walked out with 4 scripts after cutting a few hundred corals for the last frag meeting. My airway was constricted/had difficulty breathing, and O2 saturation was very low.

He said he had never seen anything like it in 20+ years in practice, and that I was a close to being in the ER.

Nothing I want to repeat. I wore gloves but no mask. Always a mask too from now on!

 

[camellia]

Dang, hope your back home soon. Thanks for the post, I've read about it before but your experience will make me take more caution.

 

[ripped tide]

ichthyoid;805536 wrote: Glad you are doing better and will be ok.

FWIW- I ended up in my Doctor's office on an nebulizer/inhaler plus O2 and walked out with 4 scripts after cutting a few hundred corals for the last frag meeting. My airway was constricted/had difficulty breathing, and O2 saturation was very low.

He said he had never seen anything like it in 20+ years in practice, and that I was a close to being in the ER.

Nothing I want to repeat. I wore gloves but no mask. Always a mask too from now on!

Last year at the swap: I showed up early to volunteer and run one of the band saws that we were using to get all the final colonies fragged. I didn't wear a mask. I had issues for 2 months afterwards. I was hacking up all kinds of funk. I never went to the doc, but it took 3 months to completely clear up.

I won't cut corals back to back anymore. I'll always be sure to take long breaks in between corals and haven't had an issue with it since.