You got that from Ret's article??? Not at all what I took from it. I saw scientific evidence that seems to debunk the claims in Thomas' post. In addition, I never saw any real evidence posted in Thomas' article. Until I see who ran the tests and the results it is hear say as far as I am concerned. Hate to see a small business suffer because of unsubstantiated hear say.
Thoughts on Thomas Vision's study?
- Thread starter nickh06
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You got that from Ret's article??? Not at all what I took from it. I saw scientific evidence that seems to debunk the claims in Thomas' post. In addition, I never saw any real evidence posted in Thomas' article. Until I see who ran the tests and the results it is hear say as far as I am concerned. Hate to see a small business suffer because of unsubstantiated hear say.
No, I was referring to the whole thing, why would any business suffer over this? He never mentioned any specific brand or person. I personally think we should all be more careful with what we throw in our tanks. This hobby isn't cheap and I'm sure there's all kinds of food, dry or frozen that contains tons of stuff we could do without. I agree that its not a thorough study by any means but I also agree with his statement on watching what we put in our tanks.
I take advice with a grain of salt. Lots of trial and error in this hobby and I think a lot of people have different views and opinions on things which is what makes this hobby unique. I don't think there's a right or wrong way to do things if it works for you.
I have never been a big fan of frozen foods mainly due to price and the fact that you have to keep them frozen but If I ever do try a few out I'm not going to let one persons post affect which one I try.
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Hey guys, I just wanted to say I have even more respect for my local reef club! Whether you disagreed with what I did or not you kept your discussion on this matter and about me respectable. I definitely appreciate your class. Anyway, thanks again for the way you guys handled this situation whether you agreed with me or not.
Thomas
Thomas
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:thumbs::thumbs::yay::yay::up::up: Bravo.
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If it's a matter of public interest, or public concern, which I think this clearly would be, and he shared the information with a broad community of interest, which he did, he should be able to disclose identifying information for the benefit of hobbyists everywhere without fear of a defamation suit. I understand his fear, but if he has nothing to hide, he should be able to use the truth of the situation as a viable defense.
I think it's great that there are watchdogs out there who are keeping the integrity of the hobby in check, but it always helps to know the 5 W's... who, what, where, when and why
You need to read this: http://www.reef2rainforest.com/2015/04/23/mercury-megadose-no-proof-in-sight/">http://www.reef2rainforest.com/2015/04/23/mercury-megadose-no-proof-in-sight/</a>
At least one journalist is thorough.
In my humble opinion, Mr. Brown has opened himself up to potentially a big can of legal trouble.
At least one journalist is thorough.
In my humble opinion, Mr. Brown has opened himself up to potentially a big can of legal trouble.
I couldn't help but respond to Jenn's linked article. My comments:
I am not a lawyer, but how is this any different than the people claiming that dooms day is around the corner or that "Jesus is coming!" Implying that the world is coming to an end? Your analogy about screaming "fire" in a movie theatre seems a bit exaggerated, all things considered. I see worse journalism and claims that this and/or that product doesn't work than what TB reported in social media. Should all those people be sued also?
I foresee no successful legal suit in the future, but it may cost TB money to defend attempts at such. Worst of all, he will probably lose credibility with many reefers in the world, but he will probably net more viewership than he had before this report in the end.
With all journalism, whether researched or not, it is all about web hits. You my friend are capitalizing on the same principle. Your article continues to spread word about the possibility of high levels of mercury in our fish food. You certainly made it clear that you disagree with the results, and I applaud you for attempting to research and state the facts; but the fact is...you have not disproved anything.
I suggest the manufacturers conduct their own tests and make them public... Unless there is something to hide.
I am not a lawyer, but how is this any different than the people claiming that dooms day is around the corner or that "Jesus is coming!" Implying that the world is coming to an end? Your analogy about screaming "fire" in a movie theatre seems a bit exaggerated, all things considered. I see worse journalism and claims that this and/or that product doesn't work than what TB reported in social media. Should all those people be sued also?
I foresee no successful legal suit in the future, but it may cost TB money to defend attempts at such. Worst of all, he will probably lose credibility with many reefers in the world, but he will probably net more viewership than he had before this report in the end.
With all journalism, whether researched or not, it is all about web hits. You my friend are capitalizing on the same principle. Your article continues to spread word about the possibility of high levels of mercury in our fish food. You certainly made it clear that you disagree with the results, and I applaud you for attempting to research and state the facts; but the fact is...you have not disproved anything.
I suggest the manufacturers conduct their own tests and make them public... Unless there is something to hide.
skriz
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He can't be sued as there's no basis for a suit. He didn't name any specific company and merely stated that he found x in one of the foods he tested. These statements are too vague and can apply to ANY food manufacturer as any of them can claim they're in the top 3.
Contamination (accidental or intentional) could result in elevated levels.
Some of the ingredients in these products are described as "fresh caught" where others are not. If the Mercury levels are truly elevated, I bet the issue will be found in the raising and harvesting of the ingredients produced in controlled environments (anything not the ocean).
I am not saying that TB is right or wrong. My only point is that the critics of TB rebutt his claim with criticism based on probabilities while toting claims of bad "science". The last time I checked, science is based on empirical evidence. However, the "scientist" rebutting TB's claim have added no new empirical evidence.
Some of the ingredients in these products are described as "fresh caught" where others are not. If the Mercury levels are truly elevated, I bet the issue will be found in the raising and harvesting of the ingredients produced in controlled environments (anything not the ocean).
I am not saying that TB is right or wrong. My only point is that the critics of TB rebutt his claim with criticism based on probabilities while toting claims of bad "science". The last time I checked, science is based on empirical evidence. However, the "scientist" rebutting TB's claim have added no new empirical evidence.
Can't speak for others but my whole point was that there was no evidence presented when the claims were made. It now appears that at least one knowledgable person has seen the evidence and has pointed out many inconsistencies. In my opinion, making public claims without providing verifiable evidence to back up said claims can do harm. Yes no names were given but in a way, that has potential to harm multiple companies. Even the ones who's foods tested fine.
Releasing the names of said companies that he mentions in the report would not make him a target for a defamation case unless he was wrong. The fact that he continues to hold the information back tells me he isn't sure of the test results.
Food producing companies absolutely test their product. It's too cheap for them not to. There is no way a company of any size doesn't spend the $50 or so/month to ensure that they aren't leaving themselves open to a massive lawsuit should their food contain something like mercury.
Food producing companies absolutely test their product. It's too cheap for them not to. There is no way a company of any size doesn't spend the $50 or so/month to ensure that they aren't leaving themselves open to a massive lawsuit should their food contain something like mercury.
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Guys, my only reason for commenting here was to thank the club for being respectable. I figured since I have posted so manyw postive things here over the years an no one followed me here it would be the same in this case. I have vowed to stay silent and watch the attacks.
Since this is my local club I will make one final post here on how things played out, and how I see them. I made a post on my FB page sharing that I recieved test results that may be a concern because of high levels of phosphates and Mercury. I went on to say that I was not sure if Mercury was bad for your aquarium and then asked if anyone could send some studies my way on that matter. I never said that the results I received were 100% right or wrong. My only claim was that I received them. I also did say I felt people should test their foods. In my mind the more results we had the more we would know if the results I received were right or wrong. The first accusations thrown my way was that I made the whole thing up. So when Ret came a knocking I only sent what I recieved to him to prove that I did indeed received results (not that they were right or wrong). Lets be clear here if I wanted this to go viral I would have made a video and spammed it everywhere. Moving forward the attacks changed from TB never received anything he was lying to what TB received was not credible.
So that is all I have to say for this matter. I thought it was fitting to share my final words on this topic here.
As for whats next for me in this hobby nothing has changed. I will definitely continue to make the best Aquarium related YT videos possible.
-Thomas
Since this is my local club I will make one final post here on how things played out, and how I see them. I made a post on my FB page sharing that I recieved test results that may be a concern because of high levels of phosphates and Mercury. I went on to say that I was not sure if Mercury was bad for your aquarium and then asked if anyone could send some studies my way on that matter. I never said that the results I received were 100% right or wrong. My only claim was that I received them. I also did say I felt people should test their foods. In my mind the more results we had the more we would know if the results I received were right or wrong. The first accusations thrown my way was that I made the whole thing up. So when Ret came a knocking I only sent what I recieved to him to prove that I did indeed received results (not that they were right or wrong). Lets be clear here if I wanted this to go viral I would have made a video and spammed it everywhere. Moving forward the attacks changed from TB never received anything he was lying to what TB received was not credible.
So that is all I have to say for this matter. I thought it was fitting to share my final words on this topic here.
As for whats next for me in this hobby nothing has changed. I will definitely continue to make the best Aquarium related YT videos possible.
-Thomas
Ret,
I have been asked to quit this debate, and I kindly agreed to do such out of respect for the person making the request.
Thank you for the respect and time it took, to find me in my local reef club. I believe it is disrespectful to simply ignore your post, so I leave you with the following:
If the goal of your blog post was to challenge the credibility of the TB report, I think you did a marvelous job of that.
My concern is that your readers appear to be confusing the concepts of a truthful report and a credible report. Credibility is the perceived validity of something, and it is entirely possible for a report to lack credibility but be 100% factual.
I'll continue to follow the story, and I look forward to seeing the test results you claim are underway.
I have been asked to quit this debate, and I kindly agreed to do such out of respect for the person making the request.
Thank you for the respect and time it took, to find me in my local reef club. I believe it is disrespectful to simply ignore your post, so I leave you with the following:
If the goal of your blog post was to challenge the credibility of the TB report, I think you did a marvelous job of that.
My concern is that your readers appear to be confusing the concepts of a truthful report and a credible report. Credibility is the perceived validity of something, and it is entirely possible for a report to lack credibility but be 100% factual.
I'll continue to follow the story, and I look forward to seeing the test results you claim are underway.
ill say this and im no scientist but my fish did stay at a holiday inn last night 
.
i have been using Reef Frenzy ever since Larry developed it and was passing it out for free at local frag swaps and my fish and tank have flourished using his food exclusively.
whoever can say whatever about it but my reef says otherwise
.i have been using Reef Frenzy ever since Larry developed it and was passing it out for free at local frag swaps and my fish and tank have flourished using his food exclusively.
whoever can say whatever about it but my reef says otherwise