Another Bryopsis Thread

[acroholic]

Has anyone eliminated Bryopsis through the use of tangs, blennies, urchins, sea hares or any other biological control?

Please note that there is a big difference between control and elimination. You can, with difficulty and a lot of work, control bryopsis, but you still have it in your system, which isn't worth much, IMO.

I don't believe it is possible and I have never heard/read of anyone doing this. Reason I ask is I have watched a large reef tank being set up that has a major case of bryopsis going on on almost all the rock in it, and the tank owner says he will eliminate it by using urchins and blennies, etc. I told him that since he is in the early stage of setup he should do the Kent Tech M treatment now while the tank is lightly stocked and get rid of it (eliminate it) once and for all. Owner states he doesn't trust Tech M treatment of bryopsis because it hurts other corals, even though all anecdotal evidence and my own personal experience is that you may lose some Turbo snails, and some montis can slightly bleach (and recover quickly), but SPS and all other corals are unaffected. I eliminated bryopsis with Tech M from my 450 gallon system 2 years ago and it has not come back since.

I think the best they can do using algae eaters is control it, as bryosis roots itself inside the live rock. Don't kill the roots and you don't kill the byropsis. And unfortunately, many algae eaters do not like bryopsis and will not touch it.

It just seems very puzzling to me that anyone would choose not to use an easy, 99% safe, proven method of elimination and only rely on control. 3-4 gallons of Tech M would eliminate it from the system they have.

 

[morganatlanta]

Wish him the best of luck, and remember not to buy any frags from him.

 

[coolsurf]

Acroholic;676051 wrote: Has anyone eliminated Bryopsis through the use of tangs, blennies, urchins, sea hares or any other biological control?

Please note that there is a big difference between control and elimination. You can, with difficulty and a lot of work, control bryopsis, but you still have it in your system, which isn't worth much, IMO.

I don't believe it is possible and I have never heard/read of anyone doing this. Reason I ask is I have watched a large reef tank being set up that has a major case of bryopsis going on on almost all the rock in it, and the tank owner says he will eliminate it by using urchins and blennies, etc. I told him that since he is in the early stage of setup he should do the Kent Tech M treatment now while the tank is lightly stocked and get rid of it (eliminate it) once and for all. Owner states he doesn't trust Tech M treatment of bryopsis because it hurts other corals, even though all anecdotal evidence and my own personal experience is that you may lose some Turbo snails, and some montis can slightly bleach (and recover quickly), but SPS and all other corals are unaffected. I eliminated bryopsis with Tech M from my 450 gallon system 2 years ago and it has not come back since.

I think the best they can do using algae eaters is control it, as bryosis roots itself inside the live rock. Don't kill the roots and you don't kill the byropsis. And unfortunately, many algae eaters do not like bryopsis and will not touch it.

It just seems very puzzling to me that anyone would choose not to use an easy, 99% safe, proven method of elimination and only rely on control. 3-4 gallons of Tech M would eliminate it from the system they have.

+1000
I'm with you all the way on this. I don't think you can eliminate it and if anything, it will start to overtake the tank as it spreads eventually smothering out your corals,etc, perhaps leading to throwing in the towel.........when it all could have been avoided to begin with.

 

[schwaggs]

I had a sea hare that ate all types of HA and Bryopsis. Once it cleaned off a rock, nothing grew in that area. Stuff would grow from around the area and eventually cover it but they can clean it off much better than humans.

I never had much luck with urchins of any type eating any algea except maybe film.

My snails never really touch it either.

Just to throw my .02 I had very bad luck with the tech M treatment. I lost a large and a medium acro to it, or some by-product of the treatment and the Bryopsis came back. I also experienced that only the bryopsis in the highly lit areas was impacted, the stuff in the lower light areas survived.

I control it with GFO and hopefully another Sea Hare if I can find a good one...

 

[crew]

There must be something out there that eats it...

 

[schwaggs]

Crew;676116 wrote: There must be something out there that eats it...

True, othewise the ocean would be covered with the stuff...

 

[crew]

Schwaggs;676118 wrote: True, othewise the ocean would be covered with the stuff...

haha exactly

 

[ripped tide]

Rumor says a Foxface will nibble at it. We'll see.....

 

[ripped tide]

Angcot70;676127 wrote: i had it bad in my old tank but when i got my foxface i stopped feeding him for a couple of days and he ate it all and it hasnt come back. (i moved my old rock into my current tank.)

I only have a few patches left, tech M has taken care of the majority, but I picked up a small foxface to get the rest. I feed SUPER lightly as it is, but i guess it's time for everyone to go on a fast.

 

[ralph atl]

YOU can't fix stupid...that said, are u sure it isn't just hair algae?

 

[sharkbait]

Acroholic;676051 wrote: Has anyone eliminated Bryopsis through the use of tangs, blennies, urchins, sea hares or any other biological control?

Please note that there is a big difference between control and elimination. You can, with difficulty and a lot of work, control bryopsis, but you still have it in your system, which isn't worth much, IMO.

I don't believe it is possible and I have never heard/read of anyone doing this. Reason I ask is I have watched a large reef tank being set up that has a major case of bryopsis going on on almost all the rock in it, and the tank owner says he will eliminate it by using urchins and blennies, etc. I told him that since he is in the early stage of setup he should do the Kent Tech M treatment now while the tank is lightly stocked and get rid of it (eliminate it) once and for all. Owner states he doesn't trust Tech M treatment of bryopsis because it hurts other corals, even though all anecdotal evidence and my own personal experience is that you may lose some Turbo snails, and some montis can slightly bleach (and recover quickly), but SPS and all other corals are unaffected. I eliminated bryopsis with Tech M from my 450 gallon system 2 years ago and it has not come back since.

I think the best they can do using algae eaters is control it, as bryosis roots itself inside the live rock. Don't kill the roots and you don't kill the byropsis. And unfortunately, many algae eaters do not like bryopsis and will not touch it.

It just seems very puzzling to me that anyone would choose not to use an easy, 99% safe, proven method of elimination and only rely on control. 3-4 gallons of Tech M would eliminate it from the system they have.

That is the problem, there is no real recorded or documented specific animal that is known to eat this particular strain of Algae. Although your general Algae eaters will nibble on it, they seem to never really get the taste for it and tend to go back to eating other strains that are more common in their normal diet. So when someone says "oh my tang eats Bryopsis", in reality more then likely what it was is the tang nibbled on it to "try" it and the owner saw that and assumed that the animal would continue this. unfortunately I have had the same situation happen to me, my foxface nibbled at some one day for a few minutes. After that never saw him ever go near it ever again. Week later treated the tank with TechM and never saw it again...

 

[ripped tide]

Those who have successfully treated with tech M and won the battle: Did you maintain normal water changes on their normal schedule? Or did you hold off until it was all gone?

 

[ralph atl]

Angcot70;676155 wrote: I guess you cant fix it .. stinks for me ...lol. I thought bryopsis was hair algae. When you google it that is what it says bryopsis is .... I had never heard the term before that is why i googled it and it said hair algae which is what i had and responded to post sooooo... Cant fix stupid :tongue2:

here is the definition i found in dictionary ...

In taxonomy, Bryopsis is a genus of marine algae, specifically of the Bryopsidaceae. It is frequently a pest in aquariums , where it is commonly referred to as hair algae.

:doh:

 

[sharkbait]

Angcot70;676155 wrote: I guess you cant fix it .. stinks for me ...lol. I thought bryopsis was hair algae. When you google it that is what it says bryopsis is .... I had never heard the term before that is why i googled it and it said hair algae which is what i had and responded to post sooooo... Cant fix stupid :tongue2:

here is the definition i found in dictionary ...

In taxonomy, Bryopsis is a genus of marine algae, specifically of the Bryopsidaceae. It is frequently a pest in aquariums , where it is commonly referred to as hair algae.

Unfortunately they are wrong. I'm sure most hobbiest would rather have HA over bryopis any day. They look somewhat similar but you will certainly know the difference between the two very soon if you have them in your tank. They may be very similar on the species level but they are way different when you have it in your tank.

Edit:

Ripped Tide;676158 wrote: Those who have successfully treated with tech M and won the battle: Did you maintain normal water changes on their normal schedule? Or did you hold off until it was all gone?

I did normal water changes; however, realize you have to buffer the water change water as not to drop your MAG level down. As long as you buffer the water change water properly to try and maintain that 1600-1800ppm MAG level you will be fine.

 

[ripped tide]

Sharkbait;676160 wrote:

I did normal water changes; however, realize you have to buffer the water change water as not to drop your MAG level down. As long as you buffer the water change water properly to try and maintain that 1600-1800ppm MAG level you will be fine.

How long did you have to keep it that high? What kind of daily dosing did you have to do to keep it at that level? And on what volume of total water? Did you notice a change in Ca and Alk? Thanks!

 

[sharkbait]

For me it was about two almost three weeks total. My total water volume was maybe 50 gallons. I didn't have a problem with my CA or ALK. I did notice my CA and ALK depleted slightly faster then normal but I dosed everyday so it wasn't a problem. As for the amount of dosing MAG, read the back of the Kent TechM bottle. It will tell you how much you need to add per 50g (If I remember correctly) and then to safely dose it over a week period. So if you needed to rasie MAG by X amount by adding 5ml of TechM you would add 1ml everyday until you reach your desired MAG level. With saying this make sure you have a very good MAG test kit.

Edit:

Angcot70;676168 wrote: I am not saying you are wrong because like I said I had never heard the term before but EVERYWHERE I searched said hair even a thread on our site ....

http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=34307">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=34307</a>[/QUOTE]

Like I said they are related on a species level. It would be like the difference between a Yellow Lab and a Black Lab. Because they are related on the species level does not mean they are the same.

 

[sharkbait]

Angcot70;676174 wrote: OIC!!! you just had to dumb it down for me ....lol.. .. the black and yellow lab thing worked

No problem, simpler analogies seem to work best

 

[smallblock]

Angcot70;676168 wrote: I am not saying you are wrong because like I said I had never heard the term before but EVERYWHERE I searched said hair even a thread on our site ....

http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=34307">http://www.atlantareefclub.org/forums/showthread.php?t=34307</a>[/QUOTE]


Wow that was 2009 where seachem's majic bryposis chemical at, maybe they gave up, or maybe just maybe it is still in development. I hope its the latter

 

[acroholic]

There is no official Tech M method to treat for bryopsis, except what people have used that successfully eliminated it from their tanks.

I am one of those, and here is my Tech M method:

Get a good test kit, like Elos. Test magnesium daily when raising and maintaining your elevated mag levels. Using only Tech M to raise your magnesium level, raise the concentration by 100 each day, so if your tank level is 1200 on Monday, dose Tech M to get it to 1300 Monday, 1400 Tuesday, 1500 Wednesday, etc., until you have reached a magnesium level of 1800. Keep your system magnesium at 1800 for two weeks straight. I did not do water changes during that time, but as John (Sharkbait) said, if you do, make sure your water change water mag. level is at 1800 prior to adding it to the tank.

After two weeks. Start doing your normal water changes, but do not do more than usual to try to lower your magnesium levels. Let your magnesium levels drop naturally through normal water changes and consumption by tank inhabitants. This means you will continue to have elevated, but dropping, mag. levels for a period of time, and they will eventually settle back to whatever is normal for your tank.

Effects on corals/animals: I lost a few turbo snails, and some montiporas lightly bleached, never losing all their color, and these quickly recovered, so IME there was little to no effect on corals, and none on fish or any other type corals outside of Montis.

And as I have posted many times before, I do not believe it is the magnesium in the Tech M that does the bryopsis killing. If it were just the magnesium we wouldn't need Tech M. Tech M has about 22 different trace elements, including copper and other metals, in the form of ions in it, and I believe it is one of these ions that is killing the bryopsis, and the 1800 Magnesium level we test for is an indirect indicator of the concentration of the trace element that is killing the bryopsis.

I think the key to successful use of Tech M to eliminate bryopsis, rather than just knocking it back only to have it show up again later, is a long enough exposure time to a high enough concentration of the trace element that is actually killing the bryopsis, which includes the two week maintenance of the 1800 concentration and the elevated levels in the tank as the mag levels slowly drop back to normal. For me, a key factor is not doing a bunch of water changes to drop the mag level after the two week 1800 mag level period is finished, because a lot of water changes will pull the responsible Tech M trace element out of your water.

 

[sharkbait]

Acroholic;676183 wrote: There is no official Tech M method to treat for bryopsis, except what people have used that successfully eliminated it from their tanks.

I am one of those, and here is my Tech M method:

Get a good test kit, like Elos. Test magnesium daily when raising and maintaining your elevated mag levels. Using only Tech M to raise your magnesium level, raise the concentration by 100 each day, so if your tank level is 1200 on Monday, dose Tech M to get it to 1300 Monday, 1400 Tuesday, 1500 Wednesday, etc., until you have reached a magnesium level of 1800. Keep your system magnesium at 1800 for two weeks straight. I did not do water changes during that time, but as John (Sharkbait) said, if you do, make sure your water change water mag. level is at 1800 prior to adding it to the tank.

After two weeks. Start doing your normal water changes, but do not do more than usual to try lo lower your magnesium levels. Let your magnesium levels drop naturally through normal water changes and consumption by tank inhabitants. This means you will continue to have elevated, but dropping, mag. levels for a period of time, and they will eventually settle back to whatever is normal for your tank.

Effects on corals/animals: I lost a few turbo snails, and some montiporas lightly bleached, never losing all their color, and these quickly recovered, so IME there was little to no effect on corals, and none on fish or any other type corals outside of Montis.

And as I have posted many times before, I do not believe it is the magnesium in the Tech M that does the bryopsis killing. If it were just the magnesium we wouldn't need Tech M. Tech M has about 22 different trace elements, including copper and other metals, in the form of ions in it, and I believe it is one of these ions that is killing the bryopsis, and the 1800 Magnesium level we test for is an indirect indicator of the concentration of the trace element that is killing the bryopsis.

I have seriously considered setting up 22 exact systems with the same equipment, dosing, rock, sand, etc and then seeding each tank with the exact same Bryopsis and then dosing each individual trace element they list and figuring out which one it is that really is killing the Bryopsis.