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Did you buy the fish from one of the sponsors? What are you feeding the fish? Make sure they are getting food to help recover.
Anything wrong here?
- Thread starter ectogamut
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I did buy the fish from a sponsor. I am feeding them southern delight nano krill micro bite pellets, spirulina 20 flake, and frozen mysis shrimp. They have been eating like crazy which is really great. I've got them back in the qt with a fresh tank. Neither are sitting on the bottom and they seem to be resting well. Will have an update in the morning.
Alright, lights just came on. Both fish are alive and active, well, waking up. The breathing seems to have calmed down in both of them, but it's still faster than I'd like. No signs of disease or parasites that I can see. If it was velvet, then it appears that the fw dip gave them relief, but I almost want to rule velvet or at this point.
Should I introduce anything to them besides the prime, like stressgard or anything? I'd like to keep products to a minimum
Should I introduce anything to them besides the prime, like stressgard or anything? I'd like to keep products to a minimum
Here's a pic from this morning. Hopefully that has some more detail for you
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I'd watch and wait unless you have definite symptoms to treat. Feed them well and keep a very close eye on the water quality. Prime helps their slime coat so that eliminates the need for Stressguard.
If you have a definite pathogen/parasite, then address that but for now, let them be if they are acting mostly normal and eating well.
Jenn
If you have a definite pathogen/parasite, then address that but for now, let them be if they are acting mostly normal and eating well.
Jenn
That's really all I can do at this point. They're both eating well so as long as they're eating I feel ok. Today I left the overhead lights off because it seemed that they perked up with the lights out. Whenever I turned them on, the fish that seems to have taken the brunt of the damage would sink to the bottom and looked a bit more distressed. With the clean water today they both were breathing a lot easier, and I did a 15% WC, which I'll keep doing till they hit the dt. Thanks for all the help Jenn and Shrimpy, I truly appreciate your inputs!
Joe
Joe
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Glad things seem better today. I truly believe it was your parameters being off that caused the stress. Things can change really fast in a small tank. Keep water mixed up for changes and some prime on hand and I think all will be well. Also, try not to overfeed.
Well, if my parameters are off, then my tests are off, but that seems unlikely since I've tested them using the reference water that came with the seachem test kits.
Today, I turned the overhead lights on and the iller looking fish went right back to the bottom corner, just hovering there. At this point, I have to believe that he's doing this in order to heal because if the light were hurting him he knows exactly where the pvc pipe is since that's where he sleeps.
Today, I turned the overhead lights on and the iller looking fish went right back to the bottom corner, just hovering there. At this point, I have to believe that he's doing this in order to heal because if the light were hurting him he knows exactly where the pvc pipe is since that's where he sleeps.
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Do you have a room light or table lamp you could put beside the tank to use instead of the tank lights to reduce stress for a couple of days?
Yeah, I kept the overhead lights off for most of the day. I figured that if it was stressing him out he would've just moved inner the cover of the pvc pipe. But any time I turned them on he would come out and just kind of hover at the bottom corner of the tank. With the lights off he's pretty lively, so yeah, I'll keep the lights low for the next several days and try to keep the kids away from the tank. I do have 3 sides of the tank wrapped in dark material which seems to make them feel safer. I know quarantine tanks must suck for fish so I try to make it as pleasant as possible.
I keep researching different diseases, and nothing seems to match up with those markings and rapid breathing. I thought brooklynella for a sec, but there just isn't evidence of that. Plus, I think it would've likely killed him by now. The only other possibility now, I think, is an internal bacterial infection, but right now I'm still waiting and seeing. His condition was a bit improved today, which makes me happy. And his partner is showing zero signs of stress or disease, which is helping me rule out anything communicable as time goes on.
I keep researching different diseases, and nothing seems to match up with those markings and rapid breathing. I thought brooklynella for a sec, but there just isn't evidence of that. Plus, I think it would've likely killed him by now. The only other possibility now, I think, is an internal bacterial infection, but right now I'm still waiting and seeing. His condition was a bit improved today, which makes me happy. And his partner is showing zero signs of stress or disease, which is helping me rule out anything communicable as time goes on.
Ok, no real change today so far, so I'll list the symptoms the fish is showing and perhaps someone can chime in with their experiences and opinion:
- rapid breathing
- slight discoloration
- white, stringy poop, approx. 1"
- prefers to hide in ofc
- slight agitation towards other clownfish, but this could be it establishing dominance as well
On the other side of that, he is still eating well, can be quite active when not hiding in the pvc pipe, and he generally isn't acting too ill. I don't think it's external parasites because I haven't seen anything of the sort on him or his tank mate. I think that leaves internal parasites/ bacteria infection or ammonia burn. But again, my experience is limited.
As far as treatments go, so far I've done a FW dip after seeing the above symptoms, but much worse, and did a 100% WC. I emptied the QT and refilled it, adding prime in order to eliminate ammonia as a stressor. I've done daily WCs and also treat the tank with Paragard. I just ordered some Prazipro on Amazon, which will be here on Monday. That way I can have it on hand if that's what will help the fish. Hope to get some more advice here.
- rapid breathing
- slight discoloration
- white, stringy poop, approx. 1"
- prefers to hide in ofc
- slight agitation towards other clownfish, but this could be it establishing dominance as well
On the other side of that, he is still eating well, can be quite active when not hiding in the pvc pipe, and he generally isn't acting too ill. I don't think it's external parasites because I haven't seen anything of the sort on him or his tank mate. I think that leaves internal parasites/ bacteria infection or ammonia burn. But again, my experience is limited.
As far as treatments go, so far I've done a FW dip after seeing the above symptoms, but much worse, and did a 100% WC. I emptied the QT and refilled it, adding prime in order to eliminate ammonia as a stressor. I've done daily WCs and also treat the tank with Paragard. I just ordered some Prazipro on Amazon, which will be here on Monday. That way I can have it on hand if that's what will help the fish. Hope to get some more advice here.
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I would go on the prazipro route. Also avoid using fresh water dips, they add unnecessary stress on the fish IMO, what percent water change are you doing?
Stringy poop can indicate an internal parasite problem.
That seems odd for fish that are bred in captivity (all of those designer clowns come from captive breeders, either commercial ones or home-based ones).
Have you tried contacting the place you bought the fish from? If they arrived to you sick, chances are the store is dealing with the same issue(s), the seller may have some insight to offer.
Jenn
That seems odd for fish that are bred in captivity (all of those designer clowns come from captive breeders, either commercial ones or home-based ones).
Have you tried contacting the place you bought the fish from? If they arrived to you sick, chances are the store is dealing with the same issue(s), the seller may have some insight to offer.
Jenn
I have to say the stringy poop has not happened consistently. I seen to notice it only after he's hidden himself away for awhile, so perhaps it's due to being immobile?
I'm not sure the lfs will be of much help. They were pretty defensive when I told them the first pair of clowns died because they came with ich, so I think if I were to go back and tell them that their fish also have internal parasites, they'd likely ask me to leave, lol! If you remember, one of the fish came to me directly from the wholesaler bag, and the other, the one that seems ill, spent an evening in the lfs tank. I would love to bring this to my lfs' attention, but I don't think they care to see me around much anymore. I'll try to leave it at that because I don't want to get in trouble on the forums here. This is why I'm seeking advice here though, there are a ton of great people with lots of experience, so I know we can diagnose this thing with the right set of eyes on it.
I'm not sure the lfs will be of much help. They were pretty defensive when I told them the first pair of clowns died because they came with ich, so I think if I were to go back and tell them that their fish also have internal parasites, they'd likely ask me to leave, lol! If you remember, one of the fish came to me directly from the wholesaler bag, and the other, the one that seems ill, spent an evening in the lfs tank. I would love to bring this to my lfs' attention, but I don't think they care to see me around much anymore. I'll try to leave it at that because I don't want to get in trouble on the forums here. This is why I'm seeking advice here though, there are a ton of great people with lots of experience, so I know we can diagnose this thing with the right set of eyes on it.
Well how you approach things has a lot to do with how it is received.
Clowns rarely get ich, they likely had something else, for what it's worth, if they died really quickly it was more likely Brooklynella - but that's a whole other post.
When I had my shop, I wanted to know if people had issues after the fact - but that's just me. Sometimes it's 'user error' but it can absolutely happen that a sick fish makes its way to the checkout counter, I don't care how careful the store is. That's just the way it is.
Going in and 'accusing' the store of (knowingly or otherwise) selling you sick fishes is not the way to go. Discuss the problem you are having and *ask* if they have any similar observations or problems and if so, what did they do or suggest for you.
Yes, some shopkeepers will automatically become defensive - you can't control that but you can approach the situation in a way that doesn't automatically put the person you're speaking with, on the defensive.
You mentioned initially that one had only been in the shop water for an hour, and the other never hit the water at the shop (again - bad way to go about buying or selling fish - but that ship has already sailed), so it's quite possible that the problem came from the supplier - OR it happened in your tank. Approach it that way, see what you get.
A little tact goes a long way. If the store got a bunch of fish from that supplier, chances are, they had some issues too. If they didn't, then it's time to reexamine how you handled things once you got them home.
You never addressed my question about how you acclimated them - that might have a lot to do with what is going on here. So how did you acclimate them?
Jenn
Clowns rarely get ich, they likely had something else, for what it's worth, if they died really quickly it was more likely Brooklynella - but that's a whole other post.
When I had my shop, I wanted to know if people had issues after the fact - but that's just me. Sometimes it's 'user error' but it can absolutely happen that a sick fish makes its way to the checkout counter, I don't care how careful the store is. That's just the way it is.
Going in and 'accusing' the store of (knowingly or otherwise) selling you sick fishes is not the way to go. Discuss the problem you are having and *ask* if they have any similar observations or problems and if so, what did they do or suggest for you.
Yes, some shopkeepers will automatically become defensive - you can't control that but you can approach the situation in a way that doesn't automatically put the person you're speaking with, on the defensive.
You mentioned initially that one had only been in the shop water for an hour, and the other never hit the water at the shop (again - bad way to go about buying or selling fish - but that ship has already sailed), so it's quite possible that the problem came from the supplier - OR it happened in your tank. Approach it that way, see what you get.
A little tact goes a long way. If the store got a bunch of fish from that supplier, chances are, they had some issues too. If they didn't, then it's time to reexamine how you handled things once you got them home.
You never addressed my question about how you acclimated them - that might have a lot to do with what is going on here. So how did you acclimate them?
Jenn
~~~Jenn, I will send you a pm with the details of the situation. That way we can avoid some confusion here and my thread doesn't get deleted. I'm pretty sure I posted a response about how I acclimated them earlier, but I drip acclimated them over the course of about an hour after first letting them get used to the temp in the qt. I wanted to take longer but the water that the fish came in was actually yellow. That's why I've been suspecting ammonia burn, but then the stringy poop kinda threw me. Unless that's a secondary infection from the stress of ammonia burn/ qt.
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