Fing ICH AGIAN!

As soon as I catch the blue tang he is going into hypo again.

My only concern is if I go through the process of removing all the live rock again to catch all the other fish and QT them also and leave the tank fishless again.

Im planning to add 8 tangs to this tank and I dont want ich to be a problem like it was last time.
 
Well, I know this has been said thousands of times, but, tangs are ich magnets. You are doing everything right, just a difficult fish sometimes...

I'm hoping you don't have to go through another fallow period. It is like watching paint dry sometimes.

Mabye I missed it, but what size is your tank?

Best of luck!!!
 
lovely, now the powder blue tang in my QT has ich too and is breathing heavy. And 5 small fish are dead since last night. I have never had a tank startup go this wrong in my life.
 
EnderG60;815334 wrote: 57w uv running at 300gph

300 mg/hr ozone unit with a custom reactor controlled to ORP of 400

I know that 5 gallons a minute may not be that much, but I'd slow it down even more for a longer contact with the uv treatment. I have the 36w turbo twist and it at a slow stream.
 
ichthyoid;815341 wrote: FWIW-

I like quinine sulfate because it is well tolerated by the fish.

Using toxic metals, like copper, takes a toll on the fish (liver in particular). I don't care how it's chelated (made less toxic?), it's still like chemotherapy. I.E.- You need to give enough to kill the parasites, but not so much that you kill the fish.

Quinine is very specific, to the parasite itself. If you profilactically treat ALL fish, while your tank lays fallow for 6+ weeks, then there should be no vector path for infection. I have found this to be the case.

Going forward, you would also treat any new fish, prior to it being added to your system.

I have also found quinine to be compatible with the antibiotics I used, such as Maracyn I & II.

Merely keeping a fish in QT (quarantine) does not guaranty the parasites are no longer present. They are often still there, albeit in low numbers.

There is evidence from research, that fish previously infected, build up some immunity (if they survive ;)

A little trivia-
Quinine compounds are traditional treatments for malaria. Tonic water is made with quinine, and was adopted to combat the malaria parasite in colonial days. It was mixed with gin (and sugar) in drinks, thus receiving a daily dose for a 'constant serum level' in the blood. Hence, the gin & tonic.

jmaneyapanda;815314 wrote: FYI- we typically don't add enough ozone to have a germicidal affect on pathogens. And what uv wattage/exposure?

In your situation, is sounds exactly as if that fish has been harboring the parasite all along. A treatment such as copper or quinine sulfate may be the most feasible rationale for eradicating that parasite.

EnderG60;815483 wrote: lovely, now the powder blue tang in my QT has ich too and is breathing heavy. And 5 small fish are dead since last night. I have never had a tank startup go this wrong in my life.



I know you've been around forever, however, I would suggest that you re-examine these two members suggestions.

Fortunately, I don't have hardly any experience with ICH (knock on Raj's head, lol), so the advice I gave was regurgitated. These guys I would "bank on". IMHO.
 
Welp Ill be taking the tank down again this weekend to catch all the fish.

Im not going to risk things over a few more weeks after this long.

Anyone that quarantines their fish please post what you use and for how long.
 
EnderG60;815509 wrote: Welp Ill be taking the tank down again this weekend to catch all the fish.

Im not going to risk things over a few more weeks after this long.

Anyone that quarantines their fish please post what you use and for how long.


Here, this guy wrote 'the book' ... literally -

<span style="font-family: Verdana"><span style="font-size: 12px"></span></span>
<span style="font-family: Verdana"><span style="font-size: 12px">BROOKLYNELLA TREATMENT</span></span>

Quinine Sulfate is the best stuff that we have for brook outbreaks. I have used it over and over again, especially on clownfish...<u>to treat brook, ich and protozoan ciliates </u>

<u>with great success</u>. One dose, one week of treatment and it's gone. <u>If you are a marine hobbyist, you need quinine in your medicine chest</u>.


Dr. Brian G. Aukes; PhD.
Chief Pathologist, National Fish Pharmaceuticals

http://www.nationalfishpharm.com/articles/brooklynella.html">http://www.nationalfishpharm.com/articles/brooklynella.html</a>

(works it's magic on cryptocaryon too)
 
Are they recommending for treating in the display tank. Would it be considered "reef safe"
 
Sewer Urchin;815590 wrote: Are they recommending for treating in the display tank. Would it be considered "reef safe"

I do not, preferring instead to treat in a hospital tank, using the 'small aquarium' instructions (below).

I also provide large pieces of PVC, which is inert, for structure. This helps to reduce their stress, as they are not in a bare tank.

You may call them, they provide free consults: 520-298-7814
<span style="color: black"></span>
<span style="color: black">Quinine Sulfate</span>

<span style="color: black"><u>Fish Disease Diagnosis</u>: Resistant strains of Ich (especially on scaleless fish). Protozoa, sliminess of the skin (chilodonella) and Rams disease (whirling disease). Also good for resistant strains of Hexamita.</span>
<span style="color: black"><u>Fish Disease Treatment</u>: For small aquariums</em>: Use 1/4 teaspoon per 10 gallons of water. Treat every 24 hrs. with a 25% water change before each treatment. </span>
<span style="color: black">For large aquariums (above 50 gallons), ponds and central systems: Treat one time and leave in the water for 7 days.</span>
<span style="color: black">Use 50 Grams per 800 gallons.</span>

http://www.nationalfishpharm.com/products4.html">http://www.nationalfishpharm.com/products4.html</a>

(about 2/3 of the way down this ^ page)

Edit: I wish a local sponsor store(s) would carry just this one medication, if nothing else!

<span style="font-size: 17px">Hello! ... Any sponsors listening here? :shades:</span>
 
Ordering tonight.

Is it recommended as a preventative measure or only good to use after symptoms appear?
 
EnderG60;815638 wrote: Ordering tonight.

Is it recommended as a preventative measure or only good to use after symptoms appear?

I have used it preventively with good results. Just make sure you don't put a well fish, back into a 'sick' tank.

If you are committed to tearing the tank down, in order to nuke everything, you might want to call National Fish Pharmaceuticals and get that free consult on this (they might save you a LOT of work). If you do, please post their comments here.

These guys are experts in fish pathology (diseases) and related treatments. They sell and consult to most, if not all, national public aquariums.
 
No Im not going to nuke it all again. Im just going to remove the fish, but to do that I have to take all the rock out, catch the little buggers and put it all back.

Ill do it this weekend and leave it fishless for 10 weeks again while I treat the fish.
 
ichthyoid;815664 wrote: I have used it preventively with good results. Just make sure you don't put a well fish, back into a 'sick' tank.

If you are committed to tearing the tank down, in order to nuke everything, you might want to call National Fish Pharmaceuticals and get that free consult on this (they might save you a LOT of work). If you do, please post their comments here.

These guys are experts in fish pathology (diseases) and related treatments. They sell and consult to most, if not all, national public aquariums.

The only negative I have found with quinine sulfate is that it has been very destructive on biological filters. In a QT, this isnt an issue, but it needs to be used precautiously if maintaining a biological filter is important.

Edit:
EnderG60;815671 wrote: No Im not going to nuke it all again. Im just going to remove the fish, but to do that I have to take all the rock out, catch the little buggers and put it all back.

Ill do it this weekend and leave it fishless for 10 weeks again while I treat the fish.

You should come in and we can discuss this.
 
I have beat ich on many occasions on many tanks and the solution every time has been an auto top off system that holds a rock solid SG. These medications are rough on our little fishies and I think, totally unnecessary. I haven't lost a fish to disease in over 10 years..when I built my ATO system!
 
Softhammer;815801 wrote: I have beat ich on many occasions on many tanks and the solution every time has been an auto top off system that holds a rock solid SG. These medications are rough on our little fishies and I think, totally unnecessary. I haven't lost a fish to disease in over 10 years..when I built my ATO system!

:sick::o:confused2:
 
Softhammer;815801 wrote: I have beat ich on many occasions on many tanks and the solution every time has been an auto top off system that holds a rock solid SG. These medications are rough on our little fishies and I think, totally unnecessary. I haven't lost a fish to disease in over 10 years..when I built my ATO system!

Well, I'm pretty sure Daniel has a good ATO and has had a good ATO the entire time he has ben dealing with this ich. He is quite an experienced reefer. My guess it is something other than his ATO or lack thereof.
 
Yeah my system is about as stable as one can get. I have a nice ATO, all chemicals are dosed 3 times a day, temp is controlled within 1 degree blah blah blah. Im thinking I just didnt do a low enough or long enough Hypo on the blue tang since he is the first and only new fish added to the system and it was running fishless for a good 3 months before even the old fish were put back in (and they went through a 2 month hypo)

Ill be catching the fish this weekend, ordering the quinine sulfate and letting the tank go fishless for 10 weeks again.

and like i said Ive had ich many times and just up the temp and feeding and it goes away. But I want to keep it out of the system this time so I can get delicate fish like an achillies. My crash was due to a sick fish, and some still unknown coral disease snowballing into catastrophe.
 
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