Flatworm exit/fish lethargic/please help
- Thread starter basscyn
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IME it's not the actual product that causes this. It's the toxins released by the sheer number of dead flatworms. They stink... I can't even imagine what the fish breathing in that stuff must feel like 
When it happened to me I hadn't added a new fish in forever either.
Back in '03 I felt that there should be some sort of warning on the product, when it was used for extreme infestations.
To say it's a bummer, is a woeful understatement.
Jenn
When it happened to me I hadn't added a new fish in forever either.
Back in '03 I felt that there should be some sort of warning on the product, when it was used for extreme infestations.
To say it's a bummer, is a woeful understatement.
Jenn
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JennM;572034 wrote: IME it's not the actual product that causes this. It's the toxins released by the sheer number of dead flatworms. They stink... I can't even imagine what the fish breathing in that stuff must feel like
When it happened to me I hadn't added a new fish in forever either.
Back in '03 I felt that there should be some sort of warning on the product, when it was used for extreme infestations.
To say it's a bummer, is a woeful understatement.
Jenn
Jenn:
Im confused. Are you saying that youve had experience with flatworm toxicity causing giant lesions in fish, such as this?
It was 7 years ago so I don't remember exactly what it looked like, but I do remember tattered fins and otherwise fish looking really rough.
Whether there were body lesions, I don't remember, and I don't have pictures from that time.
Pre-treatment the fish looked perfect. Post treatment the ones that suffered and died, looked awful.
Today I was looking online for references of just what the toxin is and what it does, but other than anecdotal experiences similar to mine and Basscyn's, I couldn't find anything specific.
The common thread was the same - small infestations seem to be able to be treated without incident. Heavy infestations can and have taken a toll on the fish.
Not sure if their instruction sheet has changed since this was posted:
http://justmyreef.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/flatworm_exit.pdf">http://justmyreef.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/flatworm_exit.pdf</a>
[IMG]/Users/jenn/AppData/Local/Temp/moz-screenshot-1.png alt="" />/Users/jenn/AppData/Local/Temp/moz-screenshot-2.png alt="" />It says in the first paragraph that the body fluids of the flatworms are toxic.
Jenn
Whether there were body lesions, I don't remember, and I don't have pictures from that time.
Pre-treatment the fish looked perfect. Post treatment the ones that suffered and died, looked awful.
Today I was looking online for references of just what the toxin is and what it does, but other than anecdotal experiences similar to mine and Basscyn's, I couldn't find anything specific.
The common thread was the same - small infestations seem to be able to be treated without incident. Heavy infestations can and have taken a toll on the fish.
Not sure if their instruction sheet has changed since this was posted:
http://justmyreef.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/flatworm_exit.pdf">http://justmyreef.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/flatworm_exit.pdf</a>
[IMG]/Users/jenn/AppData/Local/Temp/moz-screenshot-1.png alt="" />/Users/jenn/AppData/Local/Temp/moz-screenshot-2.png alt="" />It says in the first paragraph that the body fluids of the flatworms are toxic.
Jenn
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In that case, Id be inclined to suggest the tattered finnage to be from general death and scavenging. I cant fathom how such an acute reaction and death would cause such local necrosis. That HAS to be pathogenic Uronema. Ive seen many fish die from FWE related toxicity,(none in my tanks, thankfully), and Ive never seen any symptoms like that.
I'm not trying to argue, just relaying what happened in my case... the fish looked rough when I removed them several hours after the tank treatment and the problems began to happen. The worst of them were moved to quarantine tubs (plastic laundry/utility sinks I've used forever as quarantine tanks)... no scavengers, no sharp edges, and they continued to deteriorate.
It may not make sense... but that's how it happened. Sounds very similar to Basscyn's experience.
Urnonema - a parasite? Unless the sudden stress caused a massive outbreak of something that may have been present in the water, it's unlikely.
In my case since it happened 7 years ago we'll never know, but I can tell you it's enough to turn your stomach when fish that have been healthy and thriving for years, suddenly crash.
Jenn
It may not make sense... but that's how it happened. Sounds very similar to Basscyn's experience.
Urnonema - a parasite? Unless the sudden stress caused a massive outbreak of something that may have been present in the water, it's unlikely.
In my case since it happened 7 years ago we'll never know, but I can tell you it's enough to turn your stomach when fish that have been healthy and thriving for years, suddenly crash.
Jenn
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??? Im not trying to argue either. I guess we'll have to agree to disgree. Uronema is a parasite which kills quickly and indiscriminately, making large lesions. Exactly like his fish. FWE related toxicity does not. To me, its pretty clear cut, but thats why I asked if you saw lesions.
Really sticking my neck out here, but is it possible that the FWE "attack" the Uronema-causing parasite, causing a possibly "dormant under the skin" organism to somehow change behavior based on the environment? Last ditch effort, death throes, something?
As expected...
<span style="font-size: 14px">THERE BACK !</span>
Resilient little bast*rds arent they? :yes:
Only see a few but I will be retreating this weekend with the same procedure I used initially. If anyone has any suggestions on the reapplication of Flatworm exit...I am all ears!
Livestock update.
No more casualties. All remaining fish appear to be happy and healthy as always. My "prize" red monit-cap looks pretty rough though. Very washed out. When I got it a couple of years ago it was the size of a potato chip. Now its about 10-12" accross. Pretty sweet! I dont know what to do with it. I dont know if the flatworm toxin got to it or the massive water changes.
<span style="font-size: 14px">THERE BACK !</span>
Resilient little bast*rds arent they? :yes:
Only see a few but I will be retreating this weekend with the same procedure I used initially. If anyone has any suggestions on the reapplication of Flatworm exit...I am all ears!
Livestock update.
No more casualties. All remaining fish appear to be happy and healthy as always. My "prize" red monit-cap looks pretty rough though. Very washed out. When I got it a couple of years ago it was the size of a potato chip. Now its about 10-12" accross. Pretty sweet! I dont know what to do with it. I dont know if the flatworm toxin got to it or the massive water changes.
