Help! All the fish are dead...

[jmaneyapanda]

Fish Scales2;335309 wrote: The results would reflect contaminents or non organic matters that may have entered the water column. Possibly telling us if the "grassy knoll" theory is acurate and if so what it was. MAYBE

Phrase thief!:roll:

AWT tests the ionic composition, that I know of. I even think they will send you collection kits, which assist in maintaining the integrity of the sample, but dont hold me to that!

Again, I am not saying that spraying Lysol into your tank wont hurt it. I just think sometimes aquarists need to take a bit more empitrical and forensic look into problems. For example, one of the finest coral dip I have seen in many years, seems completely counterintuitive to me. TLF's "revive", smells, looks, and tastes (just kidding), like Pine Sol. When I first looked at itr and smelled it (no, I didnt drink it!), I said "No way am I putting anything living in that!". However, it appears to be way more effective, and less harsh, than the typical iodine based dips. As it turns out, Revive has some of the same botanical extracts as Pine Sol. If there wasnt an empirical look at it, it never wouldve been used. Realistically, we surely add contaminants to our tanks EVERY SINGLE DAY. Dust is constantly going into our tanks, who knows whats in fish food, including oils, and how many of us have made a DIY product, or used a plumbing part from Home Depot? They sterilize everything, right? Yeah, right. Maybe it is I</em> who is the conspiracy theorist, but I like to rely on what we know and can prove and show, rather than ignoring that, and assuming something else.

Just my take.

 

[jennm]

One time my old boss' wife was dusting the aquarium cabinet with a cloth with Pledge on it (which she had sprayed on the cloth in another room).

As she was dusting, she noticed some algae on the front glass, so without thinking about it, she popped the lid and used the *same cloth* to wipe the algae.

OOOPS!

Wipe out. Pretty instant, too.

Jenn

 

[ralph atl]

I used awt for a year (monthly tests) due to a huge Salifert Alk mess that actually threw Habiib off of RC. The tips of my acro's were dying. Everyone pointed to alk. Well, alk was 7.5 with one kit, then 12 with another, then Habib sent me a kit from Sweden? Thatcontained a reference kit that then said 14.....blah, blah. I had like 6 different alk kits, four from salifert. I was so stressed as my acro's continued to slide. I signed up for awt, and it was phosphates the whole time! They don't test ph, but test things that don't vary much. They send u a teturn kit for samples that send back priority. Although they are not perfect, it gave me a piece of mind. Now I use Elos & DD Merck. Api gave me false readings on ammonia and phosphate. Alk was ok, off by one. And calcium was off by a reasonable number. Anyhow....

 

[zesty]

I totally Agree with Jen, this sounds totally like a chemical kill, active either in the water or heavily in the air are my first choice followed by temperature spike, followed by a cycle, you would have seen stress way before your fish keeling over from a cycle or even temperature that is unless the water was boiled.

I would look for residue on the surface, use a torch and shine at an angle and see if you can see a think slime rainbow layer or small droplets of oil formed on the surface ... if you havent changed the water since the situation you will still see the layer or droplets.

If you do, its most likely one of the following: an oil based suntan lotion, Gas from a car being filled while hands are holding the nozzle, cutting the grass prior or some other petrobased like thinners, I rag that was used to clean the edge of a tank which had been used with a prior cleaning agent or thinners etc.

Other options are bug spray, the container being used for other jobs around the house even used for water plants which may have had nitro fertilizer even this is unlikely...

Hope this helps.

 

[puttyman]

I agree with the panda. It had to be El chupacabra. If not that then the ro rinse of the filter. I always rinse with tank water. Occam's razor.

 

[linda lee]

Dakota9;334935 wrote: I didn't see that in that tank, and copme to rthink of it, mine only came with a single souce of filtration, which was bioballs which have been replaced.

My nano has a sponge (which, yes I rinse and have for a year with no fish loss), mesh bag of carbon and mesh bag of filter media. No bio balls -- I do have some LR rubble in one of the chambers though.

 

[zesty]

Occam Razer principle states that the explanation of any phenomenon should make as few assumptions as possible, eliminating those that make no difference in the observable predictions of the explanatory hypotheses or theory.

Fish unless you boil them, take them out of water for a period of time, crush them or any other insane form of torture are not going to die in that short a Period... without any other observable prediction.... temperature increase or a Cycle is very unlikely, unless your a fish were in denial.

As the likely symptoms of fish experiencing a cycle or temperature change are stress, Loss of orientation, hiding, lying down, breathing rapidly, swimming in circle chasing ones tail, standing on its head and pogoing, waving a big white sign saying "The end is Nigh" followed finally by a last breath of bubbles before they float on up high to the ocean in the sky.

I think the option of cylce and temperature increase does not meet Occams Razors principle.

What is the most obvious answer? Either Poisoning from toxins in the water... Bolt Lightening, or someone switching out your fish for dead ones... Because the symptoms meet your experiences of their sorry demise.

As before I would check the top of the water for either a film or small droplets.

 

[savingnemo754]

Okay just an update on the tank situation!

It appears that she put 68 degree water in the tank about 25-30 gallons. She mixed the salt with well water that was very cold. That in conjunction with the powerhead breaking and the canister filter going down killed everything. She didn't spray anything or have anything on her hands. It was a case of extreme shock in temp and a mini cycle.

The cloudiness was a algea bloom.

 

[ralph atl]

sorry! that sucks!

 

[cr500_af]

Not to sound insensitive, because I hate that her tank crashed, but did she forget to check/modulate the temp or did she just not know any better?
I guess anybody, with enough on their mind can forget to perform a step, but that's a BIG step to forget, you know?

 

[Reefplumber13]

cr500_af;335502 wrote: Not to sound insensitive, because I hate that her tank crashed, but did she forget to check/modulate the temp or did she just not know any better?
I guess anybody, with enough on their mind can forget to perform a step, but that's a BIG step to forget, you know?

wow i never get the water to the same temp when i do a water change. crazy that that had something to do with the fish dieing

 

[zesty]

Well thats different, in the above information you stated that you had no knowledge of temperature change... so if you believe that temperature was the cause then fine.

Maybe in future though you can gather all information before submitting, if you really wanted our assistance with a synopsis.

Jgilley, I would agree with you....

 

[Reefplumber13]

Zesty;335505 wrote: Carl, Well thats different, in the above information you stated that you had no knowledge of temperature change... so the most likely conclusion without that explanation was Toxin, with new evidence the most likely is temperature.

Please ensure in future though that you gather all information before submitting, so that we can assist you in providing a synopsis.

can temp in the water really have that big of a impact???

 

[zesty]

Not with out other forms of evidence like stress etc... or dipped in either boiling or Freezing water... but hey ho!

 

[ralph atl]

Zesty;335505 wrote:
Maybe in future though you can gather all information before submitting, if you really wanted our assistance with a synopsis.

actually he gave all the information that was needed for the correct answer.

 

[cr500_af]

jgilley84;335503 wrote: wow i never get the water to the same temp when i do a water change. crazy that that had something to do with the fish dieing

Don't get me wrong- I don't stress if my change water is a degree or so off from my tank. I'd never put in water that was 10-12 degrees colder, though.
As far as why, I don't know the physiology of temperature shock. I can't tell you what it would DO to the fish, but heck, the first thing you are told when you buy your first goldfish at the pet store is to let the temp equalize because if you don't you could hurt/kill the fish.

Again, I wasn't trying to sound like a know-it-all (Lord knows I don't know nearly enough)... I was just shocked to hear that temp difference. I just thought that was the first lesson every new fishkeeper was taught.

 

[Reefplumber13]

cr500_af;335521 wrote: Don't get me wrong- I don't stress if my change water is a degree or so off from my tank. I'd never put in water that was 10-12 degrees colder, though.
As far as why, I don't know the physiology of temperature shock. I can't tell you what it would DO to the fish, but heck, the first thing you are told when you buy your first goldfish at the pet store is to let the temp equalize because if you don't you could hurt/kill the fish.

Again, I wasn't trying to sound like a know-it-all (Lord knows I don't know nearly enough)... I was just shocked to hear that temp difference. I just thought that was the first lesson every new fishkeeper was taught.

im just saying i never heat my water up that i put in the tank its room temp and i have never lost a fish or anything

 

[fish scales2]

How often are you changing out 30% and 68 degrees is not room temp.

 

[Reefplumber13]

Fish Scales2;335530 wrote: How often are you changing out 30% and 68 degrees is not room temp.

what do you mean 68 is not rrom temp. no one ever said it was my tank is 80* all the time and its not that hot in the room its in its colder.

 

[dannybradley]

So when did it only become about temperature change? I'd call that the initial shock and the lack of biological filtration the finisher. The broken powerhead made it worse by lowering the amount of O2.

When fish are stressed they vent their waste, and with no filtration, ammonia will build up quite rapidly.