Remote Sump layout

[rdnelson]

GiulianoM;787272 wrote: I am thinking that I will go with one of these types of sinks, and build the stand for it myself.

http://www.mustee.com/product-lines/laundry-utility-sinks/11.html">http://www.mustee.com/product-lines/laundry-utility-sinks/11.html</a>

They're about $70 at THD/Lowes, and fiberglass so no chance of rusting.

The sink itself is 20" x 17", with the basin at 15" x 14" x 10" - small enough to fit, but not too small to use.


The 4" PVC main soil drain is right behind the wall, so I'll have to cut into it to splice in a 1.5" drain for the sink.

I'd imagine that I'd need to splice in a 4" sanitary tee - but do they make 4" x 1.5" tees?

Could anybody that knows plumbing offer any advice?[/QUOTE]


You can get the ones with the legs including the drain connection, faucet and feed hoses as a kit at HD for about that. Just bought one today for a member I am doing a little work for. If the 4" stack is the main waste line exiting the house, I would be cautions about it. If it backs up it will all come up your utility sink. Not sure if you can get a sanitary tee that has a 1.5" but you can get a reducing bushing that will go from 4" to 1.5".

 

[giulianom]

Sewer Urchin;787273 wrote: Hey G,
Would something like this work...

http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=203217865&R=203217865#.UCP0hqNnAxE">http://www.homedepot.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay?storeId=10051&langId=-1&catalogId=10053&productId=203217865&R=203217865#.UCP0hqNnAxE</a>

Then reduce the side down to a 1.5 inch. Seems like a plumping supply might have it cheaper.

Warning -I am not a plumber, and I did not stay at a Holiday Inn last night ; )

While you are sketching up ideas might as well figure out how the frag system will fit in, we all know it is going to happen sooner or later.[/QUOTE]

Probably - I think there are 4" sanitary tees with 2" fittings on the side, which I can reduce down to 1.5".


Sanitary tees are better because the fitting on the side is at a 90 degree angle... with the 45 degree wye I'd have to make the splice in at a higher/lower point.

 

[giulianom]

rdnelson99;787304 wrote: You can get the ones with the legs including the drain connection, faucet and feed hoses as a kit at HD for about that. Just bought one today for a member I am doing a little work for. If the 4" stack is the main waste line exiting the house, I would be cautions about it. If it backs up it will all come up your utility sink. Not sure if you can get a sanitary tee that has a 1.5" but you can get a reducing bushing that will go from 4" to 1.5".

Yeah, the 4" stack is the main waste line.. it goes down into the basement's concrete floor, then out somewhere to the sewer line I'd imagine.


Anybody here a plumber for real that can do DWV plumbing?

 

[giulianom]

I've decided to go with this layout, with a sideways 17" x 20" fiberglass sink on the right side, conveniently next to the end of the sump.

The purple plumbing is a 1" PVC overflow drain, double-bulkheaded through the fuge section of the sump and out into the sink, for water changes at the sump.

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The sink:

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202041449/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=fiberglass+utility+sink&storeId=10051#.UDk3RaNIUeE">http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-202041449/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=fiberglass+utility+sink&storeId=10051#.UDk3RaNIUeE</a>



Rather than attempt to cut into the main DVW stack, I'm going to invest in a utility sink pump to go underneath the sink:

[IMG]http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-100634178/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=FPUS1860A&storeId=10051#.UDk2xKNIUeE">http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1v/R-100634178/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=FPUS1860A&storeId=10051#.UDk2xKNIUeE</a>

The pump turns on when it senses water, and will pump the output to a convenient drain line that's overhead - I can splice into that without issues.


Now all I need is for someone to run some GFCI electrical circuits into that area...

 

[rdnelson]

Just installed one of these yesterday. Nice unit at a decent price. The advantage is that it will let some water accumulate before it starts the pump. That way the pump does not run as much. For instance, if you have your RO waste dumping into the sink, you would not want the pump running the whole time. This one would run after about 6 or 7 gallons has accumulated.


http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-25ecodZ5yc1v/R-100066810/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=Sump&storeId=10051#.UDoOVqCQl8E">http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-25ecodZ5yc1v/R-100066810/h_d2/ProductDisplay?catalogId=10053&langId=-1&keyword=Sump&storeId=10051#.UDoOVqCQl8E</a>

Sending a PM about the GFCI outlets.

 

[giulianom]

Yeah I was considering that one as well.. Its a little cheaper than the other one, too.

Replied to your PM - I may need a new breaker panel in addition to a new circuit...

 

[giulianom]

So I think I've come up with a good "semi-final" (lol) layout for this thing...


Front of the tank -

The purple lines are 1" PVC for the closed loop, connected to an Oceans Motions 4-way, fed by a Reeflo Dart/Snapper hybrid with a gate valve in between. The blue intake line is 3" PVC , tee'd in the back with two 2" intakes.

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Back of the tank -

The blue intakes are 2", tee'd to the 3" that goes to the Dart.

The green drains are 1.5", which go into the wall, down and under the floor to the sump area about 20' away.

The red returns are 2", teed off on the side to feed both upper corners.

The returns will be fed by a Reeflo Hammerhead pump due to the head pressure (~15') and GPH (~3000) desired.

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And in the sump area -

I increased the stand heights so that I could fit the 30-gallon water containers underneath the sump, saving some room.

The three drains (green) from left to right are emergency, 1st drain and 2nd drain. The emergency wouldn't get any flow under normal circumstances, so the 1 and 2 drain handle that.

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The only thing I have to plan for would be for a small frag tank - I am not entirely sure how I could plumb that in with the same sump?

 

[giulianom]

Ok, so I know this is an old thread... but no surprise, I still haven't finished things. And I probably won't until October/November 2013...

So while I wait on other things, I decided to remodel the design some before I even start on building..


The biggest addition was that I decided to go with a large water storage tank for containing the RODI.

Specifically, a Norwesco #40281, a 165 Gallon 31" Dia x 55" high plastic tank...

They're available from Norwesco's plant right in Griffin GA for about $200 - no freight charges if you pick it up.


Changing where the water is stored allowed me to lower the stands to 28" high, with the top of he sump right at 48". Allowed me to simplify the UV plumbing with a vertical layout, too.

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Future plans are to add a 48x24x12 frag tank in the basement, right outside the sump area...

 

[grouper therapy]

Looks good. I would rethink the uv plumbing though it might be hard to regulate the flow with it looped as is.

 

[giulianom]

How so?



The gate valve in the middle is supposed to allow you to direct the flow through the UV.. It's in their plumbing diagrams.

 

[grouper therapy]

Head loss fluctuations on the topside of the gate valve would also affect the flow through the uv where as if it dumped by into the tank or sump it would not be affected.

 

[grouper therapy]

If you do it as drawn I would assume a flowmeter would be used?

 

[giulianom]

grouper therapy;879217 wrote: If you do it as drawn I would assume a flowmeter would be used?

Well, not as such... Yes, I plan to have a flow meter, but it'll have to be farther up the return line, in between the plumbing here and the output at the tank.


I'm thinking of seeing if I can re-plumb the UV to return back into the sump, as you suggested... it would certainly be easier to adjust the flow on the UV that way.

 

[seth the wine guy]

Come on. Build it already.

 

[KrisDeitz]

Seth The Wine Guy;879287 wrote: Come on. Build it already.

lol i agree

 

[giulianom]

Yeah, yeah, I'll get around to building it...


Anyway, I think this is about as good as I'll get it to be laid out.

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Had to double (and quadruple) check the dimensions of the area, as there's a few things in the way (HVAC ducts, pipes, etc) and I had to adjust things to fit.


On the left, a smaller 100-gallon RODI water storage tank. Shorter so that it will fit under the stairs.

The two blue barrels inside either end of the stands are 2 x 30 gallon containers for a mixing station.. they'll be plumbed together with a pump somewhere in the middle to circulate.

I have some ideas for piping them together so that I can pour salt down in a PVC pipe fitting to get it to mix in with the water.


The dimensions of the stands are (WxDxH) 30"x20"x48", 30"x20"x28", 48"x20"x28", and 30"x20"x48" from left to right.


The UV bazooka on top of the left stand has water intake on the right, and output on the left through the long output tube that feeds it back into the sump.

The output tube needs to be that long so I can have clearance to remove the UV bulb on the right side for maintenance without anything getting in the way.

The gate valve on the output will control the flow through the UV, and the tube is long enough so that I can install a pitot-tube style flowmeter along the horizontal length.


So... Yeah... this is what I do with my spare time, when I can't yet be physically building tanks...

 

[curtismaximus]

Really cool layout man! What program are you using to draw this? Also why do you need a ball valve after the UV? The flow will already be regulated by the first one correct? I don't know much about UVs though so I was just wondering. Someone need to go over there and get your rear in gear with this build!

500 post FTW!

 

[giulianom]

Curtismaximus;880146 wrote: Really cool layout man! What program are you using to draw this? Also why do you need a ball valve after the UV? The flow will already be regulated by the first one correct? I don't know much about UVs though so I was just wondering. Someone need to go over there and get your rear in gear with this build!

500 post FTW!

The ball valves are true unions, so I can shut off the water to the UV and disconnect it if I ever needed to do maintenance.



The gate valve on the output will control the flow...

 

[curtismaximus]

Ahh that makes perfect since! Thanks for the info. Good luck with the build.

 

[giulianom]

Curtismaximus;880152 wrote: Ahh that makes perfect since! Thanks for the info. Good luck with the build.

Thanks!

The layout is in Sketchup, with which I've had lots of practice..

It's great for architectural 3D modeling like this...