Swu Iii

[washowi]

New thread is needed.....The membership needs to address why or why not go? No Attacking each other for their thoughts....or ideas...open forum to all and I want all to respond...

With MACNA coming next year, it better be good....

Need to strike while the iron is hot so they say....

 

[kevin]

apparently there was an issue with my saltwterU.com email address. Sorry about that.

 

[rhomer]

Ok I will be the first to say it. I don't attend, because I just don't like conferences regardless of their content. I really geek out on this stuff, but I just don't learn a lot from people speaking. I learn by reading, doing, and discussing. I have a tendancy to kind of space out during confernece discussions.

This isn't meant to offend, just a reason why I "a local" don't attend.

Rob

 

[dough]

Kevin, thanks for the reply, no biggie.

Please, please, please don't take my thoughts the wrong way. I am hoping that everyone takes these as neutral, random thoughts.

I know a lot of people put a lot of hard work in to this. It is a lot of hard work to pull this together and everyone should be proud of the effort.

 

[washowi]

Since everyone except the brave few will speak out, here's my take. And I do not wnat any negatives, bashing, etc. thrown at me...these are just comments to many think about for the future.


1. I have had enough coral fragging exhibitions to last me a lifetime. We do it in our club, at each Saltwater U and at LFS meeting. Personally, I would love to never see a fragging again. I would venture to say we all can do it now. I bet everyone that was there was there to get a free frag only...maybe wrong...but I bet I am right.

2. The lectures- most are over our heads...I am pretty smart, and most are over my head. The lighting stuff......except for a few out there, nobody is going to dump what they have or will be changing anytime soon. If the fish store doesnt carry it, most will not be building their own, and YES there are those of you who think it's cool and the new stuff....but for a lecture? BORING!!! Let the new stuff have a booth and those that are interested meet with them at the booth...At MACNA, that's were you saw the stuff and talked about the cool things in the industry.

3. Pretty pictures.....Walt Smith asked me last year what he could do differnet with his show....I told him.."Take me to FIJI" we all now what he does, He has a booth that can show his operation. I said 99% of the people here will never see FIJI...just run a movies of the underwater and island life that he lives in....in other words, "Take me to Fiji for 20 minutes" I know you make rock and grow beautiful corals that I can't buy direct from you.

4. Venue...I don't know how to do it, but you have to get the Zoo back like SWU1. The feeling of being in your own place and nothing going on around you but SWU is what this needs...The Aquarium SUCKED!! we know that....I am sure the Marriott was not much better..Just another trade show in the ballrooms.....not unique. The Zoo WAS unique and everyone LOVED IT!!

I have more but looking to see how this is received.....

Be nice

 

[jefft]

Washawich, you got your 3rd page in one day! lol

 

[xyzpdq0121]

washowi;39500 wrote:

1. I have had enough coral fragging exhibitions to last me a lifetime. We do it in our club, at each Saltwater U and at LFS meeting. Personally, I would love to never see a fragging again. I would venture to say we all can do it now. I bet everyone that was there was there to get a free frag only...maybe wrong...but I bet I am right.

2. The lectures- most are over our heads...I am pretty smart, and most are over my head. The lighting stuff......except for a few out there, nobody is going to dump what they have or will be changing anytime soon. If the fish store doesnt carry it, most will not be building their own, and YES there are those of you who think it's cool and the new stuff....but for a lecture? BORING!!! Let the new stuff have a booth and those that are interested meet with them at the booth...At MACNA, that's were you saw the stuff and talked about the cool things in the industry.

3. Pretty pictures.....Walt Smith asked me last year what he could do differnet with his show....I told him.."Take me to FIJI" we all now what he does, He has a booth that can show his operation. I said 99% of the people here will never see FIJI...just run a movies of the underwater and island life that he lives in....in other words, "Take me to Fiji for 20 minutes" I know you make rock and grow beautiful corals that I can't buy direct from you.

4. Venue...I don't know how to do it, but you have to get the Zoo back like SWU1. The feeling of being in your own place and nothing going on around you but SWU is what this needs...The Aquarium SUCKED!! we know that....I am sure the Marriott was not much better..Just another trade show in the ballrooms.....not unique. The Zoo WAS unique and everyone LOVED IT!!

No Bashing here from me I promise! I think it is great for open suggestions to be made. Even better when people step up to the plate and back up what they want to see. (Not that you won't or haven't in the past. More for other people to step to the plate.) If you want to see something next year, toss it out for an idea and get involved. I know I am planning on it next year.

Yes I can agree that we all have seen a fragging demo. But how many have put on a show Jake Adams did where he hands you the knife and says, "Cut... No really, cut where ever you think this coral needs to be cut!" Or hear Calfo speak more about shipping and bagging corals not just cutting them. Heck it was even more about how to get MORE cuts and better long term propragation out of your corals then just what you are going to take to the frag swap. So while we all have seen a coral cut on a wet saw, there is always something new to learn and that we can have explained personally to us. And on my end of it, the next time anyone asks, "How do I cut Xenia?!?" I am going to say, "You should have caught a fragging demo at a place like SWU! "

After speaking with Kevin a bit on MACNA, I can say that it seems to be something that everyone can and will learn from, whether you are a novice or pro...

Some of SWU went over my head. I will be the first to say so. But it made me able to get an idea about what I would like to learn more about in the future. Better yet way the chance to ask Calfo, Fenner, Adams, etc... a question and have it answered, explained and drawn out for me in person, one on one! That alone was worth the price of admission right there.

I agree that a cool venue would be nice and interesting but if it was at the zoo this year, would any more people of turned out? Without the support of the club this even is half of what it could be! THis event, I am sure, can be as big as the members would support. I am sure it is hard to work the zoo into the budget when ou can not get your own club through the doors. I do not mean this to sound bashing to anyone but it is embarrasing to me when I am taking Calfo to the airport Sunday and he asks me, "You have 400+ members in your club right?" "Right" "Where were they all this weekend?" "Ummmmmm"

On the last note, maybe it would be a great idea to have one day tickets for each day... But what were the two day tickets? $45 if you ordered before the deadline...

 

[margi]

Great points Todd!

Maybe I can address them a LITTLE...

Remember - this hobby CONSTANTLY has new people...

I loved the Zoo too (maybe we can go back there - it was my favorite venue).

We can only learn from the past and move forward. Todd - do you want to add a SCUBA componant to SWU4 (in addition to the Teen program) - you are more than encouraged to take the lead on that - it would be a great addition.

Margi

 

[fishwhisperer]

Many good points Todd. You know I have seen a lot of fragging demonstrations myself too...heck I have given them. Calfo was excellent though and brought many new suggestions to the table that I did not know. He not only talked about bagging, shipping and new suggestions for cutting a toadstool to mention just a few It was excellent. I just wish you people knew what you were missing. I'll agree some of the stuff went over my head too. What some people may not like others do though. This is a good discussion I feel.

 

[washowi]

Chris (mojo) Java is screwing with me and doing some weird stuff do i can't quote people right now (i run Firefox).

Anyway, still fragging is fragging....bagging and what not...I am not a fish store. I don't bag anything except in a ziplock baggy. But I see your points, just don't think it really applies to vast majority of the membership.

as for the scuba stuff...of course I would do it, but there has to be some commitment for the diving core of the club....I was pulling my hair out begging for divers last year and looking for boats...we would be going to someplace like Destin or Panama City FL..easy to drive to...No whining about water temperatures or visability...

This show is for the hobbyist, not the highly advanced (in my opinion) thats why you are getting a few.....the hard core guys only...lighten up and have fun stuff ----no I can't list of the top of my head an examples of light stuff....but technical stuff, I will never go to...cause I don't care....I don't need the history of the light bulb or the par ratings and the graphs that accompany the bulbs.....I don't care!!

As for the venue.....I does matter....and the schedule of events matter most...I scanned the schedule and there was really nothing I cared to hear..

That is ME and ME alone....I know all are not like me and you like the stuff but that was the killer for me....nothing that interested ME...again I am saying me....

All of you know I am the first to say MONEY doesn't matter.....but in this case for some reason it does. Here is my take, I (and ALOT of OTHER MEMEBERS as well) have devoted a lot of time to SaltwaterU 1 and 2. I needed a break big deal....but when there is a post that says you have till Friday to sign up and you get 10 free tickets.. great idea.. So I sign up on Friday....you know what? The price increased $25 on Friday.........

Slap in the face to me...So now I definitely am not going.....principle at that point....Why does everyone feel that as the time approaches the costs have to go up? Look at airlines the costs go DOWN!!! you want to fill the seats....Keep the price the same.....$75 for the day is not reasonable...I say that cause you could not buy a day pass...which is in my OPINION ONLY idiotic.

You would get so much more traffic and people if the costs are low....I maybe wrong but wasn't SWU1 only $35? LAst year was like what $125? I can't remember.... so don't quote me.


anyway I think light, lively, "pretty Pictures" nothing technical..leave that for the trade booths and techies...

Rambling on now..I will be back

 

[washowi]

And why the hell am I the only one talking hear.. I did not even go!! Where are the people that were there..What did you like...did not like? Come on everyone...even if you were apart of the event I am sure there are thing you now know you would do different...or thought was not right, etc....

 

[kevin]

Todd, the price was supposed to change in Early april. It changed earlier than friday.

As far as fragging, we tried to incorporate different things. YOu may have had enough fragging demos to last a lifetime, but there are plenty of newbies out there that have been scared to frag a coral. We had Anthony do a fragging demonstration for everyone and then Jake Adams (former MF manager) do a hands-on fragging workshop which showed a different way to look at it and realy ENGAGED the participants.

Venue does matter, we thought about the zoo, however, there are limitations with that venue as well.

Your comments are important, and suggestions to improve the conference are always accepted.

COUNT ME IN FOR DIVE TRIP

 

[mafiaman]

Poor business model plain and simple, How can you blame members for not supporting the event! The event should draw them.
Like getting mad at your neighbors for not coming to your yard sale when all you have is over priced junk.

 

[washowi]

Thursday it was $49,Friday it was $75...I know I checked both days. and frag at club meetings not SWU..Newbies or not, if they aren't member then that gets them join right....Still 2 days of fragging is overboard...

Its tough to do photography as well..without doing the hands on with your camera underwater...I seems useless to me...Most everyone has different cameras and they do different things...I would have liked to see the guy that gave it do a show of what he took pictures of (remember pretty pictures) instead of tell you how to adjust the white balance...everyone will most likely forget what he said anyway....The way to get good at photography is experiment and take LOTS of pictures.....Now I am guessing that's what he did for the lecture I was not there and nobody seems to want to give any details of what really went on fo rthe people like me that were not there.

 

[dough]

Todd, are you trying to say that you did not see any value (interest) in the conference for the price? Or you did not see any value (interest) period? You're kind of hard to follow here or I am just too tired to think.

Well, if I had known it was $49 bucks Friday I would have gone . I don't know what airline you fly but closer I get to my departure date the more the price goes up. But too that point, in this case I would think that you would want give more incentative to people to book early so you can anticipate a head count. It would not be fare to charge you $75 in March and me $40 Friday night. I would say someone would want there money back.

Besides fragging is not fragging if your doing a bonsai reef! Then your pruning.

Did the conference exceed the expected number of attendees? Or was is low?Is it something that should be done every other year?

Scuba would be of interest to me in the future. I would love to take up that hobby. My wife went to bed so I can say that. Now what would I have to give up? My reef tank or fly fishing?


Anybody have the transcripts of the discussion of water movement. Just wanted to see if my Vortech is enough.

 

[lifestudent]

washowi;39555 wrote: Thursday it was $49,Friday it was $75...I know I checked both days. and frag at club meetings not SWU..Newbies or not, if they aren't member then that gets them join right....Still 2 days of fragging is overboard...

Its tough to do photography as well..without doing the hands on with your camera underwater...I seems useless to me...Most everyone has different cameras and they do different things...I would have liked to see the guy that gave it do a show of what he took pictures of (remember pretty pictures) instead of tell you how to adjust the white balance...everyone will most likely forget what he said anyway....The way to get good at photography is experiment and take LOTS of pictures.....Now I am guessing that's what he did for the lecture I was not there and nobody seems to want to give any details of what really went on fo rthe people like me that were not there.

Todd, the cost was scheduled to increase back on April 5 to $79 from the $49 "early bird special". I cannot explain why the increase occurred the day before the event, but it was supposed to go up a month before. But come on, for 90+ days the price was $49 for the whole weekend. That was a bargain!

Regarding fragging, if it's boring to you then don't go see it. Go talk to a speaker instead. Fenner is a hoot! It was great talking to Jake again. About 6 yrs ago he worked at Marine Fish and was a senior high school. Each speaker was very approachable and available to talk to. I saw several one-on-one conversations and I myself partook in several.

On the way to lunch on Sunday, Calfo stopped and spent ~20 minutes with one attendee to help her with her photos and recommended different methods/settings for her camera. They probably shot and reviewed at least a dozen different settings while trying to improve the field of depth of her shots while she shot them using her camera.

As for eye candy, Jake Adams' second lecture contained ~100+ shots of spectacular colorful Caribbean corals. You could hear the ahhhs... :drool::tongue:

There was lots of useful info, not just theoritical stuff. While I only caught the last 10 minutes of Jake's lecture on water flow, it was very practical and counter to what many of us do.

And yes the hotel was ok, but I didn't go there for the ambviance, I went there to learn and to discuss ideas and interact with some of the speakers.

In my opinion, those who missed SWU3, simply missed out.

Bob

 

[margi]

Yup - SWU2 was expensive - but with the New Georgia Aquarium sprouting up in our backyard - well... It was fun though!!

We will try to keep SWU5 down in price and have varied topics to draw lots of interest... Anyone interested in chairing SWU5?

 

[siege]

Just my $0.02 on reading this, but not having attended (too broke), I can say this much:

I'm a newb, my room-mate isn't, but neither one of us really know much about fragging corals; certainly neither one of us has had any hands-on experience at it, only a bit of erudition. Ok, don't bash me, I don't know how long the presentation was, but I wish I'd been able to attend for that alone.

Seems like a bad bit of luck to feel far too advanced for one presentation and then technically swamped by another, but I will certainly be trying to go next year.

 

[washowi]

Lifestudent;39572 wrote: TBut come on, for 90+ days the price was $49 for the whole weekend. That was a bargain!

Bob

Bob read my thread comments, where did I say i was not a bargain for $49..?

I tried to buy it Friday....What I said is why is it $75 of Friday before the meeting? Something special happen at midnight? Why increase at all? Hold your cost....here's the deal Bob. I would say 80% of us are procrastinators. Bob you may not be one....I AM...I don't do ANYTHING till the last minute.

Do you say, "lets go the Braves game next July 21, 2008. I 'll meet ya at 7 in the parking lot"...or do like me and say. "i just got some tickets for tonights game, let head down in an hour''.....

See the problem is you are planning for the way you think and feel. What's interesting to you...That's why you get the low numbers...You need to plan for the masses..and the way people in general react and operate.

That's my take on it

 

[washowi]

Lifestudent;39572 wrote:

Regarding fragging, if it's boring to you then don't go see it. Go talk to a speaker instead. Fenner is a hoot!

Bob

Bob I didn't go...that's the problem...Once again, the people involved are to close and passionate to sit back and see the whole picture. And yes Fenner is a hoot, but so what? Simon Kruger is a hoot, Jenn is a hoot. Mojo is a hoot, Steve Shindell is a hoot..etc...I am not impressed by people just because they wrote a book....so what? I believe Steve Shindell has wrote a book!!...rather talk with him and Margi personally.

Those guys don't live here. The club members do. Fenner won't remember who I was an hour later. A club member will....Calfo yes is a fun guy. same deal, so what....they are just guys like us..learning as they go....just like us...

maybe you don't get it? I am not trying to cut down anything that was done....I am trying to HELP get people more involved...sit back and look at the big picture. Not whats right in front of you.