Fun with the PAR meter - T5, Metal Halide and PC numbers

[sammy33]

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Shanes 125g SPS reef with 3 250w Ocean Light Pendants. 14K Ushio HQI lamps are less than 3 months old. HQI ballasts over a year old. 2 110w VHO Actinic (on Workhorse ballast) 6-12 months old and 2 80w T5 Actinic Blue (Workhorse ballast) 3-6 months old. Bulbs 8" above water.

 

[glxtrix]

now that has some impressive readings!

 

[FutureInterest]

Hey Sammy,

Is the (top) reading above the water surface or just below the water surface?

Thx

 

[sammy33]

FutureInterest;44340 wrote: Hey Sammy,

Is the (top) reading above the water surface or just below the water surface?

Thx

All of the top readings are just below the surface approx. 1 inch and generally directly below the bulb/reflector.

 

[sammy33]

siege;42734 wrote: I'd like to see the PAR readings from divers noting actual PAR for various kinds coral and clam species commonly found in the home at their natural depths.

Check out this article:
http://www.advancedaquarist.com/2007/3/aafeature1">How Much Light?! Analyses of Selected Shallow Water Invertebrates' Light Requirements</a>
by Dana Riddle

The article shows this sort of data both from labaratory tests and also light reading from various locations on the worlds reefs.

 

[sammy33]

dawgdude;44437 wrote: I have a few tanks I would really like to have tested. I wanna see how my 96w PC on my 12g nano does and the difference btw my HQI 250w and my SE 250w. Ill have to figure out a time to borrow a light meter from someone.

Send me a PM and we can try to work out a time to get together. I would be glad to come over and test your lights. I do have a couple to catch up with but would like to get your setup as well...wait a minute...are your tanks in Alpharetta or Athens? :confused2:

 

[dakota]

I'm not sure if this is related to the thread or not, but I stumbled across some interesting information about DE metal halide bulbs and another reason why they have such high PAR.

The 150 DE actually draws about 214 watts.

The 250 DE actually draws around 330 watts.

Different bulbs seem to draw different amounts of power, and these results are from bulbs driven by magnetic ballasts. The electric ballasts seem to drive the bulbs much closer to the rating of the ballast.

If you are running a DE bulb on a magnetic ballast and have access to a Kill-O-Watt meter, test it out and see what it is actually drawing. It might be helpful to include it in with this testing if possible.

Looking at the PARs of the T-5s vs. DE halide setups of similar wattage made me remember this. Just thought I'd share.

 

[sammy33]

Dakota - Interesting point you bring up. HQI ballasts do overdrive the lamp a bit and increase the output. Sanjay Joshi has included some of this data with his tests on http://www.reeflightinginfo.arvixe.com/">his website</a>.

I am planning on simply including the ballast type and age with these tests. The only data I am collecting is the PAR at certain depths in the aquariums I am testing. I will also include the particulars of the lighting setup (reflector and bulb info) and will go into more detail on each test on my website.

 

[justonemoretank]

Awesome job Sammy! Love all of the hard, real world numbers! I had a friend measure the PAR on my tank and I am so depressed... :sad: My corals are growing well however I am getting no where near the PAR that you are reading?!?!
I have 6 total T5 bulbs over my 120g tank. 4 are pushed by an Ice Cap 660 Ballast and the other 2 are run by the standard Triad Ballast.
After he left I went out to the garage and found my GE 6.5K sun bulb and swapped out the Pure Actinic bulb to punch up the PAR numbers. Now the tank looks too yellow/green. :sad: Maybe my eyes will adjust.
Great ... thanks ... now I have PAR envy!
Maybe you could come and verify the low numbers if you are passing thru Roswell/Alpharetta?
Thanks.

 

[sammy33]

JustOneMoreTank - What reflectors are you using on your T5 setup? How high are your bulbs off the water?

My lamps/reflectors are about 5 inches above the water. I have a mix of TEK and Ice Cap reflectors. I plan to change these over to all ice cap reflectors to see if I can squeeze a bit more light out of this setup.

The other thing I may try is the new TEK II reflectors. They are made from the same material as the ice cap but are a bit wider and have more bends in the parabolic profile. These new reflectors are supposed to be even better than the ice cap reflectors.

It seems that these single lamp reflectors are the way to go with T5 retrofits. :up:

 

[justonemoretank]

Sammy
I am running the bulbs only 3.25 - 3.5 inches off the water surface! I cannot get the lights any closer due to the way my DIY hood and DIY light rack are designed. It is literally riding on the tank top trim. This really makes getting into the tank a monster chore. I can move the rack up manually (no mechanical actuator lift mechanism :sad:
LOL ) and suspend it from inside the hood with wire cable when I need to to get in there and do maint/feeding/whatever.
I have 4 bulbs running with TEK reflectors. The other two bulbs use the Ice Cap reflectors.

 

[showtime305]

sammy33;44284 wrote: I have measurements of my 70w Sunpod fixture on my 7g mini bow. I just need to take a picture of the tank so I can post it with the numbers (not too bad by the way!). I will post it for you in the next round of PAR tests.

Did you ever get around to putting the 70w Sunpod numbers together?

 

[sammy33]

alt="" />

<ul>
<li>250w HQI Ocean Light (at center), Aqualiine 10,000K Lamp (3 mos old), HQI Ballast</li>
<li>2x250w Reef Optix Reflector (at each end), Plus brand 10,000K Lamps (1 mos old), Advance Ballast</li>
<li>2x39w T5 Actinic, TEK Reflectors, Spec ballast</li>
</ul>

Frank's (chicagoman_35) tank illustrates the slight advantage a DE/HQI setup has over a SE/Mogul base setup. The PAR is higher in the center of the aquarium and the penetration of the light is better.

There is a spectrum difference between the HQI light in the center and the SE lights on the end. I white balanced my camera to the center of the tank so the ends look less white than the center. This was also similar to the eye but it seems more extreme in the picture. Note that this is one of the clearest reefs I have seen. The water in this tank is crystal clear!

Frank - I love your Coris Wrasse!

 

[tennistopspin]

On the subject of PAR...
Does Zooathelle that are red in color (versus blue in color; opposite ends of the spectrum) need relatively high or low PAR values?

 

[nishant3789]

from what i have heard, the more brown a coral is, the more adaptable to lower light it can be.

 

[sammy33]

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<ul>
<li>250w HQI PFO Pendant, 14,000K Phoenix (8mos old), Ice Cap electronic ballast</li>
<li>2x39w T5 (one 10K and one actinic + 8mos old), Ice Cap Reflectors, WH5 ballast</li>
</ul>

Doug's (dough) 58g setup is pushing some fair PAR. The main PFO light is about 8" above the water and the T5's are about 5".

We also tested his new Phoenix 14K lamp that is about 1 month old and the PAR was even higher. 1320 PAR at the top and 210 PAR 6" down in front of the overflow! This is a good 18-20% increase from the old lamp.

Doug - The neon green Capnella and the green superunknown (Psammacora?) are my favorites!

 

[sammy33]

tennistopspin;50508 wrote: On the subject of PAR...
Does Zooathelle that are red in color (versus blue in color; opposite ends of the spectrum) need relatively high or low PAR values?

Hmm? This is the way I understand it....

Zooxanthellae are a symbiont algae that are present in photosynthetic corals. These algae generally come in 3 shades...brown, brownish tan and brownish brown.

The colors like red, blue and green that you see in corals are pigments that the coral produces that reflect light. These pigments may also be present as sort of a blocker for excessive light in certain parts of the spectrum.

In general blue and purple corals are found higher on the reef (Tullock 1997) and are receiving lots of red light. These blue pigments may act as a filter for the intense red light (opposite end of the spectrum). Red and orange corals are generally found lower on the reef and are receiving more blue light. These red pigments in these corals may act as a filter for the overall blue light (other end of the spectrum).

Take a look at how water changes the spectrum of light and this starts to make a bit more sense:

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Non-photosynthetic corals like Sun Corals (Tubastrea) and Strawberry Corals (Dendronepthya) typically have unusually bright yellow, orange and red colorations. These corals do not produce zooxanthellae and typically do not have a brown appearance. You see only the pigment of the coral without the brown symbionts.

Hopefully this sheds some light on coral coloration. (no pun intended)

 

[FutureInterest]

+ rep! Great info and great post! Thanks for sharing.

 

[justonemoretank]

Awesome Sammy!
More Rep for you. Keep up the good work.
Oops never mind it wont let me. So the ARC mainframe says "No (More) Rep For You!" LOL

 

[dough]

Sam thanks for your time today. These readings give us a lot to think about in what we want to keep in the tank. As we discussed most of my acro's are in the middle with lower light corals on the outside of the light spread. The par readings are not as uniform across the tank as we are seeing with most tanks on this thread.

I junction with what Sam discussed about Zooxanthellae anybody is welcome to visit my tank as see all the pretty brown acros that I have. Sam and I discussed the this issue at lenght of the cause of the browning of my acros. Based upon the numbers we fell that we are seeing an abundance of Zooxanthellae due to me changing over to a new lamp and not acclimating the corals to the new lamp. Also installing a new skimmer probably produced a cleaner tank which increase the par as well. We may also be seeing a lack to nutrients available in the water columm that was once there with the old skimmer.