nitrate dilemma

[jennm]

I never said that substrate shouldn't be maintained. That's part of maintaining a tank, however we mostly would replenish periodically for substrate lost through vacuuming. A shallow substrate, vacuumed regularly and replenished from time to time. Never had to rip it all out - keep it clean, shallow and turned - add more sand as needed.

The Seachem Flourish line is formulated and marketed for freshwater planted tanks. Do you have a recommendation from Seachem personnel to use it for a marine tank? If you want to tinker with it for off-label use, that's certainly your prerogative, but I've never seen it suggested for marine use by the folks at Seachem.

Jenn

 

[russ-iv]

Bcavalli;1043108 wrote: As other stated, I believe your nitrates are being consumed by the cyno, and algae in your tank. I went through a similar situation when I started up my tank. Once your system stabilizes it should allow the biological process to keep up with the nitrogen cycle. is it possible your confusing phosphstes with nitrates in terms of it binding in material? Phosphates will bind to live rock and substrate. However, nitrates are a result, as you stated diatris building up in the sandbed and in cracks and crevices with too little flow. In your tanks current state, by adding more nitrates essentially your going to feed the algae and it will continue to flourish. I'm not critizing you, just offering an explination for the issues your currently experiencing.

ok so ringo lets step back between chemical binding and biological binding.

the rock itself does not bind nitrate. but if i take any live rock and set it in a bucket it will leach nitrate biologically. when you replace matrix or denitrate media or even the dsb the media is saturated. it isnt that the rock or media "binds" it chemically but rather biologically.

that is why i was joking with jesse when he was focusing on chemical binding rather than a "live" rock's biological.

if we were to use that same logic, we would conclude that caco3 does not remove ammonia, nitrite and nitrate from the system. but we very well know that live rock is our main filter.

as hilarious as i was trying to be. i am going to follow the redfield ratio and that is what i was getting at.

anyone running carbon had a bout of cyano and scratched their heads wondering wtf when they had no nitrate. zeo forums are filled with this same issue and even the zeo products introduce potassium nitrate.

what i can say though... 0 ppm nitrate is b.s.

relax though.
for the hilarity i didnt mention i will be running only blues, and dosing microbacter7 as well as stability.

still need nitrate though.

 

[russ-iv]

JennM;1043110 wrote: I never said that substrate shouldn't be maintained. That's part of maintaining a tank, however we mostly would replenish periodically for substrate lost through vacuuming. A shallow substrate, vacuumed regularly and replenished from time to time. Never had to rip it all out - keep it clean, shallow and turned - add more sand as needed.

The Seachem Flourish line is formulated and marketed for freshwater planted tanks. Do you have a recommendation from Seachem personnel to use it for a marine tank? If you want to tinker with it for off-label use, that's certainly your prerogative, but I've never seen it suggested for marine use by the folks at Seachem.

Jenn

yeah well no one has a nitrate deficit here either. so bail water

 

[ringo®]

Russ-IV;1043111 wrote: ok so ringo lets step back between chemical binding and biological binding.

Leave me out of this nonsense.

 

[russ-iv]

Ringo®;1043113 wrote: Leave me out of this nonsense.

 

[ringo®]

That was my first post in this thread. You quoted Brett and replied to me. Maybe it's time for a trip to the optometrist.

 

[russ-iv]

Ringo®;1043125 wrote: That was my first post in this thread. You quoted Brett and replied to me. Maybe it's time for a trip to the optometrist.

yup. hard to see on tiny iphone. i went with icons.

cant edit either so it is what it is.

(sorry brett)

 

[russ-iv]

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4-5ppm

finally.

75 ml flourish nitrogen in 300 gallons

 

[ghbrewer]

Did you run the diluted high range test too?

 

[russ-iv]

ghbrewer;1043153 wrote: Did you run the diluted high range test too?

yeah. did it this morning. 5ppm on target.

got a nice yummy bacterial bloom that will outcompete cyano if blue light inhibits growth. otherwise ill manually get it out until some sort of algae dominates it.

i now get why carbon dosers get cyano.

 

[ghbrewer]

K, was just curious, looked a little dark to trust just low range results.

 

[russ-iv]

ghbrewer;1043159 wrote: K, was just curious, looked a little dark to trust just low range results.

sorry i didnt do a diluted high range test with the pro kit. i used the red sea regular 0-50ppm one. only 5 ml of water needed.

ill update when i get home today. photos as well.

 

[russ-iv]

this is annoying.... went down to 3ppm.

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[sn4k33y3z]

I use to use red sea pro test kits, until I realized how off the nitrate test kit is. I switched the salifart test kit for nitrates and I personally think it's the most accurate nitrate test kit on the market. I suggest you try one and compare it the red sea. JM2C

 

[russ-iv]

Sn4k33y3z;1043206 wrote: I use to use red sea pro test kits, until I realized how off the nitrate test kit is. I switched the salifart test kit for nitrates and I personally think it's the most accurate nitrate test kit on the market. I suggest you try one and compare it the red sea. JM2C

problem is red sea pro, and api agree.

also i have no algae.

i tried salifert with po4 and it always read 0. thanks for the suggestion though

 

[reeferman]

how is your ATS doing?is it growing?i would guess the ATS and cyano are binding up the no3 and giving you false readings if the algae on the screen is growing nicely.you do have algae,its just where you want it.
what is it that you are needing more no3 for?i dont see too terrible much in your reef that it would need to be dosed those gross amounts of no3.not knocking it at all,just dont see that much of a demand in there.

 

[russ-iv]

reeferman;1043218 wrote: how is your ATS doing?is it growing?i would guess the ATS and cyano are binding up the no3 and giving you false readings if the algae on the screen is growing nicely.you do have algae,its just where you want it.
what is it that you are needing more no3 for?i dont see too terrible much in your reef that it would need to be dosed those gross amounts of no3.not knocking it at all,just dont see that much of a demand in there.

no algae yet.... i got a bit of cyano on it (the ats) before i dosed the nitrate but it dies back every evening.

Reason i have to dose so much is because i have 300 gallons water volume.

BTW that B.S. about blue lights not growing cyano isnt true. Cyano grew at the same expected rate. I pulled out all the cyano and dosed more mb7 and stability. No worries on it expelling no3 back in the column.

I may dose iron later but atm I need to monitor cyano growth.

For now I'll wait til nitrate drops to 1 ppm and then dose another 15 ml of flourish. I also ripped out all fan worms / coco worms. CBB will be next on my list.

only coral stress i see is the birdsnest tips are receding a lil and a tip i had to clip that was white. but whatever. Couldnt keep him with 0 nitrates, let alone dosing it.

7.8 dkh
1440 mag
3 ppm nitrate
~0 po4 (no turf algae growth or clamped clam)
430 calcium
8 ph (as usual)

all expected values.

For now the plan of action is to keep nitrates above 1 ppm, stir sand, siphon cyano, and lights out this weekend while dosing competing bacteria. fuge light will stay on though. I dont care if i cultivate it in the jail below

 

[russ-iv]

update

no change of cyano after culling friday night. bought a CBB. also bought a couple fuzzy sticks from another lfs. Yellow tang terrorized the CBB, but after putting my cell with a picture of another YT he stopped.

anyway.

as a test i did a few brief tests of interest of the lfs vs my own water. (forgive the unclean counter)

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right side are mine, left lfs (please note... even less nitrate than the last pic of it)

i will list my tests lfs/mine

po4: .08/0
trate: 2ppm/2ppm
kh: 6.5/7.5

i didnt test the other fluffery. tests were done within 1 hour of purchase.

i dosed 10 ml phosphate

update photo of tank after purging last night and today

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i moved some stuff around after the sand cleansing, fuzzy stick purchases. i dont plan on doing anything else but dose for the next couple weeks

target is 16:1 trate/po4

 

[sn4k33y3z]

Now having seen a picture of your tank and reading through the thread. I now suggest and see that your LR appears new and not established. Dry rock takes a while to become alive. If your display tank is new, I also believe that newer tanks leach a bit of silicate in to the water Coloum, this feeding the Cyanobacteria.

Personally, I think it's simply just a matter of time and your system will "balance" out.

 

[russ-iv]

Sn4k33y3z;1043314 wrote: Now having seen a picture of your tank and reading through the thread. I now suggest and see that your LR appears new and not established. Dry rock takes a while to become alive. If your display tank is new, I also believe that newer tanks leach a bit of silicate in to the water Coloum, this feeding the Cyanobacteria.

Personally, I think it's simply just a matter of time and your system will "balance" out.

please do not add anything ever again to my thread. diatoms outcompete cyano in every test.

cyano has no composition of silicate and never will. you give some incredibly poor advice.

2 for 2. salifert recommedation vs rs pro. (i trust api more than salifert) im not trying to be mean. but whatever relevance you had, goes out the window.